Shoplifting epidemic

[whole diary]

[froome]

There has been a lot of coverage of the rise of reported shoplifting in the media over the last couple of weeks, with some quite desperate stories from small retailers about their vulnerability. The BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) website includes a list of the reported rises by police authority in the last year (from May/June 2022 to 2023), and one statistic in this stood out for me - the police force with the second highest increase, up over 80% from the previous year and well ahead of all other authorities apart from the City of London - was the British Transport Police.

This confused me at first, as I wondered what did shoplifting have to do with them? But then I realised that retailing has become an important factor on stations, and most retail outlets are very open, which must make them prone to being stolen from. It isn't an issue I have ever considered in terms of stations or have heard discussed anywhere.

[eightonedee]

Hoping that this forum isn't a research tool for the perpetrators of these crimes,  a few moments reflecting on the layout of the newish units created by the rebuilding of Reading Station indicates that they have been badly designed for enabling staff to keep an eye on "customers ".

I don't know if that's the fault of the original designers of the units orthe occupiers fitting out contractors. Some are not so bad (Hotel Chocolat comes to mind)

[grahame]

Hoping that this forum isn't a research tool for the perpetrators of these crimes ...

Hmmm ... I don't think it is.  One of the roles of the moderation team is to spot and moderate posts that significantly inform or encourage illegal activities but it's not something that crops up very often

... The BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) website includes a list of the reported rises by police authority in the last year (from May/June 2022 to 2023), and one statistic in this stood out for me - the police force with the second highest increase, up over 80% from the previous year and well ahead of all other authorities apart from the City of London - was the British Transport Police.

This confused me at first, as I wondered what did shoplifting have to do with them? But then I realised that retailing has become an important factor on stations, and most retail outlets are very open, which must make them prone to being stolen from. It isn't an issue I have ever considered in terms of stations or have heard discussed anywhere.

Firstly, beware statistics where they start from a low base especially (isn't the City of London a tiny force?) and statistics which are comparatives.  But, sure the temptation at a station where there is good public transport (some may argue this!) to aid in getting away must be great. And shops and outlets are designed to tempt legal purchase decisions and it's hard to separate those from illegal  obtaining permission.

Where we do have a problem on the railways - and I am not going to pinpoint specific places - is in fare evasion, which could be seen as a varient of shoplifting. 

[TaplowGreen]

Hoping that this forum isn't a research tool for the perpetrators of these crimes ...

Hmmm ... I don't think it is.  One of the roles of the moderation team is to spot and moderate posts that significantly inform or encourage illegal activities but it's not something that crops up very often

... The BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) website includes a list of the reported rises by police authority in the last year (from May/June 2022 to 2023), and one statistic in this stood out for me - the police force with the second highest increase, up over 80% from the previous year and well ahead of all other authorities apart from the City of London - was the British Transport Police.

This confused me at first, as I wondered what did shoplifting have to do with them? But then I realised that retailing has become an important factor on stations, and most retail outlets are very open, which must make them prone to being stolen from. It isn't an issue I have ever considered in terms of stations or have heard discussed anywhere.

Firstly, beware statistics where they start from a low base especially (isn't the City of London a tiny force?) and statistics which are comparatives.  But, sure the temptation at a station where there is good public transport (some may argue this!) to aid in getting away must be great. And shops and outlets are designed to tempt legal purchase decisions and it's hard to separate those from illegal  obtaining permission.

Where we do have a problem on the railways - and I am not going to pinpoint specific places - is in fare evasion, which could be seen as a varient of shoplifting. 

Fare evasion is effectively addressed by barriered gatelines - perhaps a similar turnstile system could be trialled in order to prevent shoplifting - the supermarkets are trying it now in their self service areas with the need to swipe a receipt barcode to get out.

I have also seen the "organised looting" which occasionally rears its head around Oxford Street/Regent Street and elsewhere

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-66448113

- what would address/deter it more than anything of course is a highly visible Police presence on foot in our High Streets and shopping areas, hard to remember when that was last widely seen (unless there is a "Pride" march taking place of course, they seem to throng the streets for them) - proactive beats reactive every time.

[froome]

Hoping that this forum isn't a research tool for the perpetrators of these crimes ...

Hmmm ... I don't think it is.  One of the roles of the moderation team is to spot and moderate posts that significantly inform or encourage illegal activities but it's not something that crops up very often

... The BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) website includes a list of the reported rises by police authority in the last year (from May/June 2022 to 2023), and one statistic in this stood out for me - the police force with the second highest increase, up over 80% from the previous year and well ahead of all other authorities apart from the City of London - was the British Transport Police.

This confused me at first, as I wondered what did shoplifting have to do with them? But then I realised that retailing has become an important factor on stations, and most retail outlets are very open, which must make them prone to being stolen from. It isn't an issue I have ever considered in terms of stations or have heard discussed anywhere.

Firstly, beware statistics where they start from a low base especially (isn't the City of London a tiny force?) and statistics which are comparatives.  But, sure the temptation at a station where there is good public transport (some may argue this!) to aid in getting away must be great. And shops and outlets are designed to tempt legal purchase decisions and it's hard to separate those from illegal  obtaining permission.

Where we do have a problem on the railways - and I am not going to pinpoint specific places - is in fare evasion, which could be seen as a varient of shoplifting. 

Fare evasion is effectively addressed by barriered gatelines - perhaps a similar turnstile system could be trialled in order to prevent shoplifting - the supermarkets are trying it now in their self service areas with the need to swipe a receipt barcode to get out.

I have also seen the "organised looting" which occasionally rears its head around Oxford Street/Regent Street and elsewhere

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-66448113

- what would address/deter it more than anything of course is a highly visible Police presence on foot in our High Streets and shopping areas, hard to remember when that was last widely seen (unless there is a "Pride" march taking place of course, they seem to throng the streets for them) - proactive beats reactive every time.

Do the British Transport Police actually 'police' (in the old fashioned sense of being publically visible and even having having a public presence on foot). I know they are very visible when there are large-scale events such as football matches bringing crowds to a station, but at any other time, do they act as many of us would expect a police officer to act? I would have thought it should be very easy for them to be visible outside retail premises now and again, and stations must be very effective places for CCTV^▸ (Closed Circuit Tele Vision) to operate.

[infoman]

could bar codes not be de-energised,like goal line technology in football?

So if you passed under a bar leaving the supermarket the item not de-energised would set off a bleep/buzz?

[TaplowGreen]

could bar codes not be de-energised,like goal line technology in football?

So if you passed under a bar leaving the supermarket the item not de-energised would set off a bleep/buzz?

.............or perhaps fire a laser to vaporise the shoplifter in question?

[Bmblbzzz]

could bar codes not be de-energised,like goal line technology in football?

So if you passed under a bar leaving the supermarket the item not de-energised would set off a bleep/buzz?

Thousands* of lines of items are fitted with near-field communication devices to set off alarms at supermarket doors. Not just supermarkets, all sorts of shops. I'm rather surprised that you seem not to have encountered this (by which, to be clear, I mean you haven't heard someone setting the alarms off – I'm not making allegations of shoplifting!). Mostly, it doesn't seem to result in any action unless there's a security guard standing right there.

*Vague term, it's a guess. I suspect probably an underestimate by a factor of a hundred or so.

[infoman]

Bmblbzzz
I'm rather surprised that you seem not to have encountered this (by which, to be clear, I mean you haven't heard someone setting the alarms off

I am offended by your comment,do you think I am thick or something?

Yes I have heard the alarm go off,but if you have ever been near the security guards "desk" when the alarm goes off.

Its generally a high value item that has been bought in another outlet,and in the shoppers personal bag.

[Bmblbzzz]

Bmblbzzz
I'm rather surprised that you seem not to have encountered this (by which, to be clear, I mean you haven't heard someone setting the alarms off

I am offended by your comment,do you think I am thick or something?

Yes I have heard the alarm go off,but if you have ever been near the security guards "desk" when the alarm goes off.

Its generally a high value item that has been bought in another outlet,and in the shoppers personal bag.

I'm sorry you're offended, no offence was intended and there was certainly no suggestion you might be "thick". I'm not really sure what you found offensive about my comment; you might simply never have heard such an alarm, through chance, being hard of hearing, only shopping in small shops which tend not to have them, or whatever other reason. But you have heard it, we've both heard it, we know what sets it off... there doesn't really seem anything to get offended about???

[grahame]

We each have our way of reading and understanding ... and as I'm pretty sure here that I see a case of MISunderstanding here, so let's move on.

Our forum is read by a very wide range of members and guests indeed ... and there are times I find myself writing in answer to a member's post but going back and explaining things from first principles - on the grounds that whilst that member may understand the context, other readers may not and it's helpful to fill them in.

[broadgage]

A variety of electronic tagging systems are available to detect theft, but they are labour intensive to deploy and therefore tend to be used only on high risk goods.
Such systems are becoming less useful for two reasons, firstly, ways to defeat them are becoming more widely known and secondly they cant physically stop the theft, only sound an alarm. And what happens when the alarm sounds ? Nothing in most cases, shop staff are generally reluctant to intervene as they may be at risk of violence and the police do not normally attend.

Shoplifting has been de-facto legalised and is not normally a police matter if the value of the goods is under a certain limit.

I suspect that more shops will be "thief proofed" in ways that require payment first and then pass the goods to the customer. Argos and Screwfix have already been mentioned in this respect.
Another approach is to only admit customers to a small central area of the shop that that contains no goods. The rest of the shop is secured behind a brick wall about a meter high with polycarbonate glazing above and up to the ceiling. The customer may view the goods, but cant touch them until payment is made to the shopkeeper.
Such shops are hated by the left, by the political correctness department, and by the poverty lobby.

Yet another approach is not to admit customers into the shop at all. The front window is a giant touch screen, divided into segments each containing an example of the goods on offer.
The customer desiring say a can of beans, touches the relevant section of the window, and after paying by cash or card, the goods are dispensed via a hatch. This can be achieved robotically, but a child is cheaper. Also hated.

[stuving]

I suspect that more shops will be "thief proofed"

Of course shops have mostly been doing that by moving on line. That largely solves the problem for the shop, but shifts it to the buyer who may never get what they have paid for.

[infoman]

Has any one on the forum been on the railway course which explains abour Respect and Dignity?

The parting words I recall were, its not the way the comment was intended, it is the way it was perceived.

[broadgage]

I suspect that more shops will be "thief proofed"

Of course shops have mostly been doing that by moving on line. That largely solves the problem for the shop, but shifts it to the buyer who may never get what they have paid for.

I wonder how long it will be before supermarkets stop charging for home deliveries ? Whilst the staff and vehicles cost money, home deliveries are almost immune to theft.