Allsopp felt 'sick' after social services referral

[whole diary]

[grahame]

From the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page)

Kirstie Allsopp has told the BBC she felt "sick" after being contacted by social services for allowing her 15-year-old son to go interrailing around Europe.

On Monday, the broadcaster wrote on social media that her son had returned from three weeks travelling abroad with another teenage friend, and without parental supervision.

Allsopp said she was "profoundly shocked" when Kensington and Chelsea Council informed her the matter had been referred to social services shortly after she discussed it on X, formerly Twitter.

A spokesperson for the council said its "absolute priority" was the safety of children.

Allsopp's son travelled to Paris, Brussels, Amsterdam, Berlin, Munich, Marseille, Toulouse, Barcelona, and Madrid with a 16-year-old friend earlier this summer.

[stuving]

There's been a burst of letter-writing to the Times and Sunday Times on much the same topic, which got a bit competitive about "I was younger than you when I ...". Two examples I saw sounded well outside the norm even for the date they happened.

First Rodney Goodwin, who went with two friends on a four-day camping punt trip along the Thames in 1952. They were aged 14, 12 and 11. Then there was Johnny Cameron who, from the age of eight in 1962, went to and from boarding school in Broadstairs by sleeper from Inverness, underground, and another train from Victoria. 

I suspect in both cases there might have been some monitoring of what they were up to, or at least whether they had gone missing, that they might not have been not aware of at the time.

[Oxonhutch]

I look to my youthful adventures, a three speed bike and a fitness I no longer possess, and say "Thank God!"

Made my childhood and gave me great life experiences. Does the Isle of Man classify as abroad? Magic time.

[PhilWakely]

I was just about to leave my pre-teen years in the mid-1960s when I embarked on my first solo adventure, but that was just to London for the day by train from Exeter Central. Times, though, have changed and I would not let my grandchildren go out with friends of their own age without adult supervision in this country - let alone abroad.

[GBM]

I do remember Dad taking me to London from Kingswear (well Dartmouth actually) on the overnight train.
He had an interview there the next day.
We went underground to one of the termini with an overbridge.
Left me there telling me not to move far from there and he'd be back by noon.
Think I was around 7 or 8.

Just an adventure for me.
I felt safe and happy watching trains.

Wouldn't allow our grandchildren to do that these days.

Pre teens I would be given a 7 day rover in the school holidays from Dartmouth, and left to my own devices all day, returning around dark.

[Chris from Nailsea]

Allsopp's son travelled to Paris, Brussels, Amsterdam, Berlin, Munich, Marseille, Toulouse, Barcelona, and Madrid with a 16-year-old friend earlier this summer.

Blimey!    That's a rather impressive itinerary, for a couple of unaccompanied teenagers: well done to them, I say. 

Continuing with my possibly contentious view: what actually is the issue here?  Is it just about age?

The age of consent (for sexual activity) in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom) is 16 (in the Vatican City it's 14) but the minimum age for marriage is 18.  In the UK, the minimum age to buy alcohol, or watch pornography, is 18, but in some states in the USofA, it's 21.

If Kirstie Allsopp, who clearly knows him better than Kensington and Chelsea Council, is comfortable that her son is sensible enough to undertake such an adventure - good luck, I say.

[grahame]

Times have changed ... I was travelling alone by train from very early,  to school in the London 'burbs.   Think I must have learned early - even in those days I knew the alternatives if there was a problem. Line through Sydenham Hill shut, walk to Gypsy Hill. Line to Petts Wood shut, use St Mary Cray. No trains running, 227 from Crystal Palace to Chiselhust Common and the 61 or 161A).   It wouldn't be the same these days of course as London no longer has any bus routes with an "A" on the end.

Always travelled, often alone.  First alone, abroad was probable at the age of 12 or 13.  Very used to rover tickets and overnight trains.  Rarely in a sleeper.  But times have changed;  Lisa was a bit shocked and my letting Chris and Kim travel when she moved over, but there are personal element that are having me hold back further comment in public.  The USA is a different world.

[Chris from Nailsea]

Looking at the vote results so far, I'm rather clearly in a minority. 

[ChrisB]

Allsopp's son travelled to Paris, Brussels, Amsterdam, Berlin, Munich, Marseille, Toulouse, Barcelona, and Madrid with a 16-year-old friend earlier this summer.

Blimey!    That's a rather impressive itinerary, for a couple of unaccompanied teenagers: well done to them, I say. 

Continuing with my possibly contentious view: what actually is the issue here?  Is it just about age?

Pretty much. Accusations flying all over x/Twitter of 'neglect'. Many pointing out that there isn't actually any set law as to whether you can or can't - depends totally on the details of the case....but it seems that the posts on twitter are in a majority of saying 'no way, Jose'....most before 18, never mind 16. Kirsty's lad was a couple of weeks shy of 16 though.

One could say that with modern communications, it is safer now than it was a decade or more ago.

[Chris from Nailsea]

Thanks for your comments, ChrisB 

I agree that, with the aid of modern technology (mobile phones and all) it's probably safer for youngsters to venture abroad these days.

But what magical gift are they apparently given, on their eighteenth birthday, which suddenly enables them to do so many things they wouldn't have been allowed to do, yesterday?

 

[JayMac]

My mum would send me to the shop, about 3/4 mile away, aged 7, to get staples such as bread, milk and 20 Dunhill, in exchange for a 10p mix-up of sweets.

We'd play quite far from home at that age too. Down by the River Tone. Mum would say, "If you drown I'll kill you." Out all day during the holidays. Always home for tea. If we didn't come home by tea time we wouldn't get any.

Aged 10 I was going on train trips to Bristol and Devon, usually with a friend the same age, but occasionally on my own. I went to Paddington alone aged 12.

There were some boundaries though. Aged 13 I wasn't allowed to go and see Queen at Wembley or Knebworth with friends in 1986. Mum and stepdad said I could see them on their next tour. Queen (with Freddie & John Deacon) never toured again.

[broadgage]

Presuming a teenager of reasonable intelligence and maturity, then in my view overseas travel at 15 is fine. Travel broadens the mind and should be encouraged from a relatively young age.
I cant agree with those who state that it " might have been acceptable in the past, but not these days, the world has changed"

Has the world changed much ? have sexual or other attacks actually increased ? or do we simply hear more about such crimes.

The general availability of cellphones is a considerable advantage not available in my youth. I have no faith in a mobile phone in case of sudden violent attack or robbery, but they are most useful in case of transport breakdowns or delays etc.

I am in favour of raising children under free range conditions.

[TaplowGreen]

https://youtu.be/VKHFZBUTA4k

 

[grahame]

Presuming a teenager of reasonable intelligence and maturity, then in my view overseas travel at 15 is fine. Travel broadens the mind and should be encouraged from a relatively young age.

I agree with you, and it's what my parents did for me and what I did for my children.  Would it happen at the next generation?   I don't know and I am being very careful about posting concerning my grandchilren, the oldest of whom is just a couple of years younger than Kirsty's.   It comes down to the individual child,  and the trip planned.

Now - putting myself in the shoes of a concerned neighbour of Kirsty, would I report a safety concern about a neighbour or contact?  I have done so, twice, though in both cases with regards an old man living alone. On one occasion, it turned out he was in hospital and on the other he was found passed away when the police broke in.   And just this week, a neighbour was furious with me because he thought I had called the authorities on him; in fact it wasn't me and the threshold for concern had been far from met, one element of which would have been to go round and check / ask myself first.

I have been on the other end of this too. I have had a knock at the front door and on answering it had my "rights" read to me, telling me that is what had been reported (damaging unauthorised works to a listed building) I could go to prison for six months.  Interestingly within earshot of a class of delegates I was training in the main reception room.  And, like Kirsty is reported as being, I was shocked and disturbed.

We each have our own threshold of reporting and won't always get it right.  We do know who reported us as even when this one turned out to be "no case" she was reporting us for other things, and did have us caught out for putting an 11m3 outbuilding in the grounds of our listed home when the limit for a listed building such s ours was not the normal 15m3 but 10m3.  We got to know the lady who read me my rights very well - met her at a regional conference 15 years later and in all the people we know, we spoke on very friendly first name terms.  But her initial approach, dictated I'm sure as a standard procedure, upset me - and the phone call she took a minute or two later from her office to confirm she was safe indicated perhaps just how upset people can get.

[CyclingSid]

Yes times have changed in 40, 50 or more years. I was recently thinking about the son of a neighbour, largely constrained by parents concern.

Myself by a similar age I got myself to school on Hayling, initially by bus and then walked. No problems apart from detouring via the sea shore and best quality Chichester Harbour mud on the way home. Later my friend and I were allowed to go where we wanted within the island. Later Havant station became a home from home, once I could name every stop on the Waterloo slow I used to be allowed to do the announcements. Boarding school meant train etc across to either side of Brighton. The heavy stuff went PLA (another thing long consigned to history). By this time holidays could mean a trip with my friend to Waterloo and Plymouth.

The other change of course is school leaving age, at 16 your mum didn't take you to work, did she?