Train GraphicClick on the map to explore geographics
 
I need help
FAQ
Emergency
About .
Travel & transport from BBC stories as at 09:15 28 Mar 2024
- Easter travel warning as millions set to hit roads
- Man suffers life-threatening injuries after train stabbing
- Baltimore Bridge Collapse
Read about the forum [here].
Register [here] - it's free.
What do I gain from registering? [here]
 02/06/24 - Summer Timetable starts
17/08/24 - Bus to Imber
27/09/25 - 200 years of passenger trains

On this day
28th Mar (1988)
Woman found murdered on Orpington to London train (*)

Train RunningCancelled
06:57 Swansea to London Paddington
07:43 Swansea to London Paddington
08:18 London Paddington to Cardiff Central
08:30 London Paddington to Weston-Super-Mare
09:00 Bristol Temple Meads to London Paddington
09:12 London Paddington to Cardiff Central
09:29 Weston-Super-Mare to London Paddington
09:30 London Paddington to Bristol Temple Meads
09:46 Westbury to Swindon
10:15 London Paddington to Cardiff Central
10:30 London Paddington to Weston-Super-Mare
10:41 Cardiff Central to London Paddington
11:00 Bristol Temple Meads to London Paddington
11:05 Swindon to Westbury
11:16 London Paddington to Cardiff Central
11:23 Weston-Super-Mare to London Paddington
11:30 London Paddington to Bristol Temple Meads
11:50 Cardiff Central to London Paddington
12:15 London Paddington to Cardiff Central
12:17 Westbury to Swindon
12:30 London Paddington to Weston-Super-Mare
13:15 Swindon to Westbury
14:19 Westbury to Swindon
15:14 Swindon to Westbury
Short Run
05:40 Bristol Temple Meads to Penzance
06:38 Weymouth to Gloucester
06:54 Taunton to London Paddington
08:34 Exeter Central to Okehampton
08:38 London Paddington to Westbury
09:50 Cardiff Central to London Paddington
Delayed
05:03 Penzance to London Paddington
05:23 London Paddington to Swansea
05:33 Plymouth to London Paddington
05:55 Plymouth to London Paddington
06:00 London Paddington to Penzance
06:05 Penzance to London Paddington
06:50 Westbury to Weymouth
07:10 Penzance to London Paddington
08:03 London Paddington to Penzance
08:35 Plymouth to London Paddington
09:04 London Paddington to Plymouth
An additional train service has been planned to operate as shown 09:13 Bristol Temple Meads to Gloucester
09:37 London Paddington to Paignton
10:04 London Paddington to Penzance
10:23 London Paddington to Oxford
10:35 London Paddington to Exeter St Davids
PollsOpen and recent polls
Closed 2024-03-25 Easter Escape - to where?
Abbreviation pageAcronymns and abbreviations
Stn ComparatorStation Comparator
Rail newsNews Now - live rail news feed
Site Style 1 2 3 4
Next departures • Bristol Temple MeadsBath SpaChippenhamSwindonDidcot ParkwayReadingLondon PaddingtonMelksham
Exeter St DavidsTauntonWestburyTrowbridgeBristol ParkwayCardiff CentralOxfordCheltenham SpaBirmingham New Street
March 28, 2024, 09:21:21 *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Forgotten your username or password? - get a reminder
Most recently liked subjects
[146] West Wiltshire Bus Changes April 2024
[117] would you like your own LIVE train station departure board?
[80] Return of the BRUTE?
[63] Infrastructure problems in Thames Valley causing disruption el...
[49] Reversing Beeching - bring heritage and freight lines into the...
[27] CrossCountry upgrade will see 25% more rail seats
 
News: the Great Western Coffee Shop ... keeping you up to date with travel around the South West
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: 1 ... 10 11 [12]
  Print  
Author Topic: New railway stations proposed for Cranbrook, Newcourt and Marsh Barton (merged topic)  (Read 142904 times)
devonexpress
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 294


View Profile
« Reply #165 on: August 26, 2018, 15:07:03 »

Moving the goal posts?

From Devon Live

Quote
Back in March, it was announced by Cllr Stuart Barker, cabinet member for economy and skills, that the funding deficit is expected to be closed within the next six months.

Cllr Alan Connett asked ‘when does Devon County Council anticipate the new rail station at Marsh Barton will be in use’ at the full council meeting last Thursday.

In response, Cllr Andrea Davis, Cabinet Member for Infrastructure, Development and Waste , said: “The situation at Marsh Barton Station is that we had a station design that met Network Rail’s design standards as agreed by the steering group (which includes Network Rail).

“However, following the award of the contract to design and build the station, Network Rail's design standards changed. This has led to the design being changed and subsequent rising costs and a funding gap. We have discussed this with the Department for Transport who shared our concerns, but they have recognised the merit of the scheme.

“The opening of the Station is dependent on closing the funding gap. We are working on several options including reducing costs and securing additional sources of funding from Network Rail and potentially the GWR (Great Western Railway) franchise extension. Also, we have recently submitted a bid to Government for further funds as part of national bidding process. So, at present we have no planned date for bringing the station into use.”

Sure Devon County Council would have been notified if Network Rail was planning to change its design standards?  Then again this is Great Britain nobody talks to each other in departments anymore, half the reason why projects always go over budget. It seems to me there is too big a plans for Marsh Barton, why not cut down the amount, and spend just enough to get it open and paying for itself and then do the fancy non important stuff later?
Logged
johnneyw
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 2257


From station to station, back to Bristol city....


View Profile
« Reply #166 on: August 26, 2018, 16:46:17 »

I've notice before that some schemes seem to start simply enough and then they take on a life of their own becoming more ambitious/complicated with the attendant increase in costs. I've seen this with Metrowest 'improvements' whereby not happy to reopen lines and increase frequency from and to Temple Meads, we now have to have through services going way beyond.

Isn't it sometimes a good idea just to start modestly and expand if the scheme takes off?

« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 17:13:36 by johnneyw » Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40687



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #167 on: August 26, 2018, 19:20:47 »

Isn't it sometimes a good idea just to start modestly and expand if the scheme takes off?

Yes.

I've ... built a business and set objectives ... and also set myself a few campaigning objectives since I got involved with some of this rail stuff. There's balances - to set the objectives high enough to make them complete as a working solution, yet not too high that you can't reach them.   And there's a very interesting decision to make as to whether (if you set objectives low) it will be easy to pick up and develop further based on initial success, or whether you're in an environment where you'll not get another bite at the cherry.

The other thing - and I was warned by a member of this forum in 2005 (before it was a forum). - is as you get involved, don't get so involved that you have no way back out.  Now you are not one to be stepping out with risk, JohnneyW, but I add that for completeness of the story.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
johnneyw
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 2257


From station to station, back to Bristol city....


View Profile
« Reply #168 on: August 26, 2018, 21:50:09 »

I think Devonexpress's above observation about Marsh Barton is such a useful one. It would be great to have a complete in all aspects station up and running from day one but if that 'day one' is distant or uncertain due to high costs then surely a pared down version with an earlier start date could be seen as a serious option to consider. As long as later improvements would not, as a result, be compromised then there is surely little to loose and much to gain?
Logged
TonyK
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 6435


The artist formerly known as Four Track, Now!


View Profile
« Reply #169 on: September 06, 2018, 21:18:11 »

I think Devonexpress's above observation about Marsh Barton is such a useful one. It would be great to have a complete in all aspects station up and running from day one but if that 'day one' is distant or uncertain due to high costs then surely a pared down version with an earlier start date could be seen as a serious option to consider. As long as later improvements would not, as a result, be compromised then there is surely little to loose and much to gain?

The exemplar here must be the Portway Park and Ride station, near Avonmouth. I shall ignore that when the P&R (Park and Ride) was planned, the council were told that if they moved it closer to Shirehampton station, people could get the train if they wanted as well as the bus, advice that was ignored at the time because no-one caught trains then. But before the full Metrowest Rail plan was cobbled together, there was as close to a promise as you will ever get from a council that a station would be built there by 2013, at a bargain cost of £400,000. This was to be the first use of a modular construction designed to provide basic platform facilities at low cost. Five years later, it is scheduled to open in 2019 at a cost, reported by te Post a year ago, of £2.23 million, plus another £400,000, to ponce up the park and ride a bit.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2018, 19:47:40 by Four Track, Now! » Logged

Now, please!
Trowres
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 749


View Profile
« Reply #170 on: September 06, 2018, 22:08:49 »

Quote
This was to be the first use of a modular construction designed to provide basic platform facilities at low cost

After seeing the works to extend Trowbridge and Freshford, I wonder if the modular construction really works out cheaper than the old-fashioned brick / infill?
Logged
ellendune
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4452


View Profile
« Reply #171 on: September 06, 2018, 22:13:30 »

Quote
This was to be the first use of a modular construction designed to provide basic platform facilities at low cost

After seeing the works to extend Trowbridge and Freshford, I wonder if the modular construction really works out cheaper than the old-fashioned brick / infill?


Bricklaying takes time and if you are trying to do the work overnight or in possessions then you need to minimise time. Modular construction might have seemed to take a long time, but I suggest the traditional methods would have taken even longer. 
Logged
TonyK
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 6435


The artist formerly known as Four Track, Now!


View Profile
« Reply #172 on: September 06, 2018, 22:21:08 »

Bricklaying takes time and if you are trying to do the work overnight or in possessions then you need to minimise time. Modular construction might have seemed to take a long time, but I suggest the traditional methods would have taken even longer. 

At Portway, which will be a single platform on a single line, it's taken 5 years longer so far.
Logged

Now, please!
johnneyw
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 2257


From station to station, back to Bristol city....


View Profile
« Reply #173 on: September 07, 2018, 00:06:02 »

So what was the reason for this change from a modular platform at Portway to a more traditional brick one?  Additionally, when was this change of plan made?
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40687



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #174 on: September 07, 2018, 08:13:12 »

Quote
This was to be the first use of a modular construction designed to provide basic platform facilities at low cost

After seeing the works to extend Trowbridge and Freshford, I wonder if the modular construction really works out cheaper than the old-fashioned brick / infill?


Having seen the works at Melksham, I suspect that relative price comes down to how long the line / track has to be closed.  Modular construction as we have seen it has lead to an enormous amount of time and effort away from the line of track and clearance distance from it, but then with the extra platform sections being placed in a very short time.  Modern safety standards preclude work being done on an open railway with the brickies hopping out of the way as a train approaches, even if that train in under a temporary speed restriction (TSR (Temporary Speed Restriction)) and there's a lookout man employed to tell the team doing the actual job to get out of the way.

Logic is that new platforms on new tracks could still be cheaper using old fashioned methods.  But then would you have the skilled team available, or is it best simply to have a single pool of roving station builders, putting in platforms at Kenilworth one week, Freshford the next, Stonehenge and Wilton next year, Pilning Westgate in 2020, and Portishead in 2021.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
martyjon
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 1941


View Profile
« Reply #175 on: September 07, 2018, 08:25:24 »

Quote
This was to be the first use of a modular construction designed to provide basic platform facilities at low cost
After seeing the works to extend Trowbridge and Freshford, I wonder if the modular construction really works out cheaper than the old-fashioned brick / infill?
Having seen the works at Melksham, I suspect that relative price comes down to how long the line / track has to be closed.  Modular construction as we have seen it has lead to an enormous amount of time and effort away from the line of track and clearance distance from it, but then with the extra platform sections being placed in a very short time.  Modern safety standards preclude work being done on an open railway with the brickies hopping out of the way as a train approaches, even if that train in under a temporary speed restriction (TSR (Temporary Speed Restriction)) and there's a lookout man employed to tell the team doing the actual job to get out of the way.

Logic is that new platforms on new tracks could still be cheaper using old fashioned methods.  But then would you have the skilled team available, or is it best simply to have a single pool of roving station builders, putting in platforms at Kenilworth one week, Freshford the next, Stonehenge and Wilton next year, Pilning Westgate in 2020, and Portishead in 2021.

Sorry, don't you mean Portishead 2120.  Grin
Logged
grahame
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 40687



View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #176 on: September 07, 2018, 08:33:51 »

Sorry, don't you mean Portishead 2120.  Grin

Love the joke ... but writing what could be done.
Logged

Coffee Shop Admin, Acting Chair of Melksham Rail User Group, Option 24/7 Melksham Rep
Do you have something you would like to add to this thread, or would you like to raise a new question at the Coffee Shop? Please [register] (it is free) if you have not done so before, or login (at the top of this page) if you already have an account - we would love to read what you have to say!

You can find out more about how this forum works [here] - that will link you to a copy of the forum agreement that you can read before you join, and tell you very much more about how we operate. We are an independent forum, provided and run by customers of Great Western Railway, for customers of Great Western Railway and we welcome railway professionals as members too, in either a personal or official capacity. Views expressed in posts are not necessarily the views of the operators of the forum.

As well as posting messages onto existing threads, and starting new subjects, members can communicate with each other through personal messages if they wish. And once members have made a certain number of posts, they will automatically be admitted to the "frequent posters club", where subjects not-for-public-domain are discussed; anything from the occasional rant to meetups we may be having ...

 
Pages: 1 ... 10 11 [12]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.2 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
This forum is provided by customers of Great Western Railway (formerly First Great Western), and the views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that the content provided by one of our posters contravenes our posting rules (email link to report). Forum hosted by Well House Consultants

Jump to top of pageJump to Forum Home Page