Through trains: London to Bristol, Weston and beyond (merged topics)

[whole diary]

[Chris from Nailsea]

A couple of updates on this topic -

From the Bristol Evening Post, 'Plea for more train carriages in Bristol':

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/news/Plea-train-carriages-Bristol/article-623538-detail/article.html

Also from the Bristol Evening Post, 'MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) lands high-profile role in reshuffle':

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/news/MP-lands-high-profile-role-reshuffle/article-626339-detail/article.html

[paul7575]

The 52 carriages for FGW^▸ (First Great Western) in the rolling stock plan was always expected to include more for the LTV^▸ (London [and] Thames Valley) lines than the 'Bristol area'. But these announcements (such as the 200 carriages in December) are not the full picture - they could well provide 11 x 4 car units for the Cardiff - Portsmouth route, and send 10 x 3 and 1 x 2 car 158 up north. Net result 12 extra carriages for Bristol...

I'd emphasise that is pure guesswork on my part, but it would fit both the previous government announcements, and the 44 car story the Bristol media came up with previously, albeit with no real evidence AFAICS^▸ (As Far As I Can See)...

Paul

[Btline]

Local MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) John Penrose has expressed his concern over Government plans to electrify the Paddington to Bristol main rail line which could mean a cut in vital commuter services between Weston-super-Mare and Bristol.
The Government is currently assessing the viability of electrifying the Great Western main line. Mr Penrose is a strong supporter of electrification, but he^s concerned that if the line to Weston isn't included in the plans then the intercity High Speed Trains (HST^▸ (High Speed Train)) which currently serve the town may no longer be able to reach it as they would be limited to the new electric lines only. The rush hour HSTs are an essential component in reducing overcrowding on Weston's commuter rail services and have made a real difference since they were introduced after extensive lobbying of First Great Western by Mr Penrose and others 18 months ago.
The Weston MP has now written to Lord Adonis, the Secretary of State for Transport, demanding to know whether Weston will be included in the Government's electrification plans and that the Minister consider the impact of his decision on Weston-super-Mare. He has also sought reassurances that, if Weston^s track isn^t electrified, steps are taken to preserve and improve current levels of services. He has said that this will be crucial for the future of the town, especially if the Government pushes ahead with its plan to impose 12,000 new houses on the sea-side town which will potentially add to Weston^s 20,000 commuters.
John said: ^Over the last few years we^ve managed to make significant progress in introducing more high capacity diesel intercity trains at rush hour to help relieve the overcrowded commuter services.
^But if the main line is electrified and doesn^t include the track to Weston, those trains won't be able to reach us because they will only run on the new electric lines. This could mean a massive cut to our current levels of service and would be a giant step backwards. We would return to unacceptable levels of overcrowding and would end up pushing people off the train and back into their cars, adding to the already-overcrowded M5.
^It^s crucial that the Government realises the effects that part electrification of the line could have on Weston. That^s why I^ve written to the Minister responsible and urged him to look at the impact of his plans. If the Government decides that electrification is not viable for Weston then they need to ensure that the current service levels are maintained, and must be willing to improve them in future too to relieve the ever increasing congestion on our roads and motorway.^

Source: http://www.politics.co.uk/mps/press-releases/party-politics/conservatives/weston^s-rail-commuter-services-could-be-cut-warns-town^s-mp-$1312081$452165.htm

[inspector_blakey]

Not like you to post hysterical articles from the local politicians speculating wildly about things that probably won't happen in several years' time, is it btline...? 

[John R]

I'm surprised to hear that Mr Penrose thinks the rush hour HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) were only introduced 18 months ago after extensive lobbying by him. I could have sworn that I've been using them for the last 6 years.

Electrifying only to Weston won't solve the problem either as two of the sets work up from Exeter and Plymouth.
 

[Lee]

Like him or loathe him, Penrose has managed to clock up some more media coverage with this - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/somerset/8157329.stm and http://www.thewestonmercury.co.uk/content/twm/news/story.aspx?brand=Westonmercury&category=news&tBrand=westonmercury&tCategory=znews&itemid=WeED17%20Jul%202009%2016%3A31%3A16%3A893

Interesting response from the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about), which either does or doesnt answer the question, depending on how you look at it:

Commuter services between Weston and Bristol would not be affected by changes to the line between Weston and London.

[Graz]

So if this happens and we don't see HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) between Bristol and Weston any longer, I would actually call this being affected

[Chris from Nailsea]

From politics.co.uk:

Weston-super-Mare MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) John Penrose is demanding that the Government provides extra rail carriages for services to and from the sea-side town to provide relief to over-crowded commuter services. The move comes after track improvements between Weston and Worle were shelved.

In a letter to the Secretary of State for Transport, Lord Adonis, the local MP has demanded that alternative measures to increase capacity and provide relief to over-crowded commuter services must be taken now that the track improvements have been dropped. The MP has already pushed the Government on First Great Western^s bid for an extra twelve carriages for the region, as these would increase the capacity of at least two peak time services from Weston to Bristol. But he is now also calling for the Government to provide the carriages to lengthen a further four of Weston^s peak time services, which should provide the necessary capacity for commuters until 2019.

John Penrose said: ^These extra carriages are crucial if Weston is to have a reliable and comfortable train service which can be used by commuters and tourists alike and provide a viable alternative to using our roads and avoiding the chaos at Junction 21.

^ve spoken to Network Rail chiefs and they tell me that these extra carriages can provide the same advantages as the Weston and Worle track improvements which is welcome news. But it^s only the Government who can guarantee the new carriages and funding required.

^It^s vital that we provide Weston with the train service it deserves. That^s why I^ve written to the Minister responsible and will continue to push the Government until they deliver the extra carriages we need.^

[grahame]

Where there is a fairly frequent ("a number of trains every hour") service that is crowded, there seems sense in building capacity by lengthening rather than running more trains.   If the service is measured as "trains every n hours" then it doesn't make sense.

I recall grumbling that the seven seventeen morning train to Swindon had been cancelled.  "But Graham - the next train was twice as long" was offered in jest by an FGW^▸ (First Great Western) Manager at the time.  Problem was - next train was seven fortyseven that night.

[bemmy]

AIUI^▸ (as I understand it) the track capacity improvements were to improve reliability, not a plan to run more trains.

The present government is not going to target extra coaches at areas that have never voted Labour and never will. And when the Tories get in, and discover that they can't save half as many billions as they thought by making sick people work and waving the magic wand of efficiency across all govt departments, they will have to bring the hatchet down on the railways and other public services.

Although the line does clearly need longer trains at peak times, there is absolutely no way that a Tory government would ever fund it, even if they weren't inheriting a disastrous national balance sheet. Outside of London, I don't believe that they will invest a single penny in any transport infrastructure that isn't roads. I haven't forgotten the 1980s.

[John R]

Although the line does clearly need longer trains at peak times,

Which services are overcrowded these days? The only one I can think of is the 1753(2?) ex Bristol in the evening. The HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s soak up the commuters in the morning.

[bemmy]

Although the line does clearly need longer trains at peak times,

Which services are overcrowded these days? The only one I can think of is the 1753(2?) ex Bristol in the evening. The HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s soak up the commuters in the morning.

I don't travel on any particular service often enough to know which ones are regularly overcrowded, so maybe I'm being unfair -- it is only the down evening ones where I've seen overcrowding this year and perhaps each time it was the 1754, for all I remember. You're right about the morning services -- for a long time I didn't bother trying to use them after being left on the platform a few times at Parson St. The loco set has helped too.

[JayMac]

Perhaps there is someone on this forum who regularly travels on local services that run from Weston to Bristol who may have an idea of loadings at various times of the day. Someone from say, Nailsea?

[Lee]

The latest from a favourite MP^▸ (Member of Parliament) of this forum...

From the Weston & Somerset Mercury:

Train service disappointment

Train services in Weston could deteriorate if the Government 'doesn't get its act sorted' - according to the town's MP.

John Penrose has hit out at the Government's plan to electrify the track between London and Bristol, resulting in it scrapping plans to provide additional diesel carriages for the area to First Great Western.

Under the plans announced last year the rail giant could have received an additional 44 carriages for the South West region.

Mr Penrose has today written to rail minister Lord Adonis demanding to know how the Government will fulfil its capacity targets to 2014 now that it will not provide the region with the carriages it needs.

He says in addition the Government has still not reached agreement on carriage leases from across the country.

At present, they are due to lapse in the middle of next year, meaning the South West could lose 24 of its existing carriages, reducing capacity and service levels further.

Mr Penrose said: "This is a double blow for Weston rail users.

"The new carriages would have improved the service significantly, giving Weston's hard-pressed commuters an alternative to using their cars.

"Weston deserves a first-class train service, but if the Government doesn't get its act sorted, we'll end up with a second-rate one.

"That's why I'm pushing it to come clean on how it's going to increase capacity as it promised.

[clevedonian]

I am really happy with the weston-bristol service in general, maybe a few extra carriages are needed, but there is 1/2hourly service each way, and regular london trains in the morning and evenining peak.

If you compare yatton to somewhere like yate i think the service is so much better.

however any campaigning to improve the service is welcome!