Usage On New Devon & Cornwall Services

[whole diary]

[Chris2]

I'd also be interested to know what usage is like on the Newquay services.

I have used the new Newquay branch line services regularly since the new timetable. Several times I have ended up being sent by bus from St. Austell with quite regular detours for the bus to Bugle then onto Newquay. The connections are tight travelling from Plymouth especially the 1310 as there are four minutes to change, but the train is not held at Par as it would mess up other connections on the return Journey.

The trains seem busier than they were before the time table started, there were about thirty people on the bus going to Newquay every time when the connection is missed. The first service of the day towards Par typically has about ten to fifteen people onbard when I board with the train stopping at Luxulyan quite regularly.

It is a massive improvement especially with the advance purchase fares that are available for all stations on the branchline from Luxulyan to Newquay going to Plymouth. ^2.50 standard class and ^4.00 first class one way all day. Which makes it cheaper for people from Par to buy a ticket from the branch line and not use the branchline and I know of people that are doing this.

[Lee]

Thanks Chris. Could you possibly clarify a few points for me (and bearing in mind that its still early days):

1) Is that 30 people travelling to Newquay during the middle of day?

2) Is 30 passengers the high end usage-wise, and what would you say average passengers per train was?

3) What percentage of usage increase would you say there was?

4) What rolling stock is generally being used?

5) Any evidence that missed connections/buses are having a negative effect on passenger perception of the service?

[Chris2]

1) The thirty people travelling to newquay was about two in the afternoon, catching the bus from St. Austell. When I spoke to a member of platform staff at St. Austell, it is apparantly quite common for them to be using a 33 seater minibus (They said there have always been too many people to warrant sending the passengers in taxis).

2) The minimum i have seen on the train is 12 and the maximum is over 40 on the 1828 ex Par on 05/01/09

3) I have only started using the service since the new timetable.

4) The rolling stock is a class 153.

5) People complain that the bus is sent from Par to St Austell, but this is because Par is generally unstaffed later in the day, and the bus station is right next to St Austell Station, so easier to get onto the bus, with luggage as the car park at Par is not suitable for a bus so you have to walk out to the road. People would like to hear more announcements, if the connection will be missed, not announcing at Lostwithiel to stay on the train to St Austell. They say it is better than going all the way to Truro to be bussed back to Newquay or intermediate stations as St Austell is significantly closer especially for the branch line stations. People do not like the missed connections as the Train is quicker by the time it takes for the bus to arrive. The staff in Plymouth station occasionally give out the wrong information, like saying the late running 1310 will make the connection in Par. It would also help if the staff at st Austell station were informed earlier as sometimes they do not know that they are meant to be organising transport as control do not contact them.

[Lee]

Many thanks again.

Sorry about the confusion over 3)

I asked because you said the trains seem busier than they were before the timetable started. It would be good to make a comparison if any members have relevant info.

[Btline]

Those fares are good! However, what the people at Par are doing is non-legit - look at another post on this forum with more details.

It's a shame those connexions are being missed (although a 4 min connexion should be achievable - come on FGW^▸ (First Great Western)!) as people WILL be put off. The lack of clarity on announcements will not be helping this.

[devon_metro]

Its 4 minutes for a reason, it is not a registered connection, you can't expect it to be held for you! It clearly states on the timetable that 5 minutes is the minimum connection time.

[Chris2]

Its 4 minutes for a reason, it is not a registered connection, you can't expect it to be held for you! It clearly states on the timetable that 5 minutes is the minimum connection time.

It is a registered connection as Par has a minimum connection time of three minutes labelled on all their timetables.

[Chris2]

Many thanks again.

Sorry about the confusion over 3)

I asked because you said the trains seem busier than they were before the timetable started. It would be good to make a comparison if any members have relevant info.

I put that in, as I have been passing the train station, there seems to be more people on the platform, than before the change of timetable.

[devon_metro]

Its 4 minutes for a reason, it is not a registered connection, you can't expect it to be held for you! It clearly states on the timetable that 5 minutes is the minimum connection time.

It is a registered connection as Par has a minimum connection time of three minutes labelled on all their timetables.

Really? Very optimistic if walking from one end of an HST^▸ (High Speed Train) over the footbridge.

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

can you get a seat on the exmouth one yet?

[Chris2]

Its 4 minutes for a reason, it is not a registered connection, you can't expect it to be held for you! It clearly states on the timetable that 5 minutes is the minimum connection time.

It is a registered connection as Par has a minimum connection time of three minutes labelled on all their timetables.

Really? Very optimistic if walking from one end of an HST^▸ (High Speed Train) over the footbridge.

I think the three minute connection at Liskeard is more optimistic

[eightf48544]

Why is it we can't get connections right in this country?

Is it 3 minutes, 4 minutes or 5 minutes.? If you arrive at the front of an HST^▸ (High Speed Train) and have to walk the length of the train to a footbrdge or subway or lift! How long are you allowed?

It's another case of lack of "attention to detail" not getting it right for every connection at every junction station.

Plus clearly advertising what are guarenteed connections and the conditons under which they are guarenteed.

So you would have to include advice to the TM^‡(resolve) to advise people wishing to make a particular connection to move down the train to alight. Ideally if travelling with a seat revervations the reservation would have been made in the nearest coach.

Then what happens if the connecting train is late how long will the connection be held? Plus what alternative transport will be provided if the connecting train is later than the holding time.

It's not difficult it just requires "attention to detail."

To answer my own question "Why is it we can't get connections right in this country?" It's because the "bean counters" can't understand how to cost a Network and don't understand that connecting services provide a valuble additional
contribution to the worth of the total network.

Reliable connections will increase rail usage, as many people cannot make the journeys they want without changing trains. Without reliable connections these potential passengers will find alternative means of transport, usually a car.

[vacman]

Running the St Ives half hourly at night is pointless, for e.g. it used to run to connect into/out of mainline trains after about 1800, now any commuters from Penzance have given up as the 1737 from Penzance arrives at St Erth 5 mins after the branch has left, the next one from Penzance is 1905 and arrives at St Erth about 4 mins after the branch has left, no-one wants to sit at St Erth for 25 mins at this time of year, particularly when there is a bus from Penzance to st Ives every half hour direct! those are just a couple of crap connections, if you look through the timetable there's more!

The Newquay is being quite well used with no less than around 20 people on each service.

Oh, and the St Ives is running around empty after about 1800, what a waste of diesel! it should be hourly after 1800 with every trip to/from Penzance.

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

Running the St Ives half hourly at night is pointless, for e.g. it used to run to connect into/out of mainline trains after about 1800, now any commuters from Penzance have given up as the 1737 from Penzance arrives at St Erth 5 mins after the branch has left, the next one from Penzance is 1905 and arrives at St Erth about 4 mins after the branch has left, no-one wants to sit at St Erth for 25 mins at this time of year, particularly when there is a bus from Penzance to st Ives every half hour direct! those are just a couple of crap connections, if you look through the timetable there's more!

The Newquay is being quite well used with no less than around 20 people on each service.

Oh, and the St Ives is running around empty after about 1800, what a waste of diesel! it should be hourly after 1800 with every trip to/from Penzance.

build it and they will come....

just give it time

[bemmy]

Running the St Ives half hourly at night is pointless, for e.g. it used to run to connect into/out of mainline trains after about 1800, now any commuters from Penzance have given up as the 1737 from Penzance arrives at St Erth 5 mins after the branch has left, the next one from Penzance is 1905 and arrives at St Erth about 4 mins after the branch has left, no-one wants to sit at St Erth for 25 mins at this time of year, particularly when there is a bus from Penzance to st Ives every half hour direct! those are just a couple of crap connections, if you look through the timetable there's more!

I don't suppose the bus is run by First, and it couldn't be that they make more money from bus passengers than train passengers....