Handy hints and tips

[whole diary]

[tramway]

As much as I hate to stand in front of a booking office window trying to sort out cheapest fares I^m afraid that is the only thing to do until the ridiculous fares structure is sorted.

I have every sympathy with the staff, and other waiting passengers, as it took me the best part of 20 minutes running the options in my Ellesmere Port thread. Apparently you can^t split the single to Ellesmere from Bristol via Stoke so paid the separate tickets. And it was only after I said that I could get from Ellesmere to Newport for ^10 after a quote for ^32 (Newport/Filton is certainly less than ^22) did I get the price I was after. All told just over 40 quid for the round trip, from a minimum of ^59.30 for the Off peak return.

[grahame]

As much as I hate to stand in front of a booking office window trying to sort out cheapest fares I^m afraid that is the only thing to do until the ridiculous fares structure is sorted.

Indeed - on the occasions that I use a split ticket I feel somewhat embarrassed.  But ... where the regular fare being offered is very high (I tend to judge in pence per mile) I feel morally as well as legaly justified.  That's not to say that in some cases  there are some on the TransWilts) the fares are so low that they kill the economic case for a train service, and on there I actually wish that the cheaper fares were 25% higher because THAT would make the economic case stack up for a proper service.

I have found that 9 times out of 10 (at least), the operations (at least) the operations staff are very helpful and curteous when asked for split tickets, especially if you're very clear about what you're asking them for.  A tiny minority (and it is a TINY minority) let their disagreement with the splitting system influence their behaviour and will actually attempt to mislead you into buying something more expensive than you need. Thankfully, most of these I am aware of are now resolved / closed cases.

[devon_metro]

Amusingly, the routing guide can also save some cash. As it stands, Taunton - Bristol Parkway is valid via Westbury

This is priced at ^10.40 Off Peak Day Return

Taunton - Westbury "NOT BRISTOL"

This is priced at ^15.20 Off Peak Day Return

Sheer madness

[Chris from Nailsea]

Interestingly, the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) also covered this subject of split tickets (suggesting ticket vending machines should offer them), over the weekend!

There are calls for ticket machines at stations to be improved because passengers are often unable to access the cheapest fares.  BBC research suggests that passengers can save almost 40% on some routes if they buy split tickets, or two separate fares for the same journey.

Machines only allow passengers to buy tickets starting where the machine is.

The cheapest fare available on the day from a ticket vending machine for the 0800 from Bristol Temple Meads to London is any Anytime Single priced at ^74.50.

Passengers can buy a single from Bristol to Didcot for ^21.30 and a single from Didcot to London at ^24, giving a saving of ^29.20, or 39%.

The machine, however, will only sell the first portion of that split fare. Split tickets have to be purchased online or at a ticket offices.

For full details, see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7861827.stm

[inspector_blakey]

Good to see an ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) spokesman showing their usual flair for inept public relations.

"Split tickets are being used in a way they were not intended for.

"We actually go further than other industries and allow people to buy and use them if requested, but we won't go out of our way to encourage passengers to use them in a way that was not intended when there are other good value-for-money fares available."

The implication is that we should be very grateful that we are allowed to use split tickets at all. I would love to hear him explain how it is good value that you can occupy the same seat, on the same train, for the same journey and with a little ingenuity save 39% on the through fare!

Passenger Focus, as they often are, are spot on on this issue but from what I can tell they seem to be an entirely toothless organization with no actual clout to get the train operators to change anything.

[Btline]

I do sympathise with the ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) view. The machines are designed to sell common tickets easily (hence their limitations) in order to reduce queues.

BUT:

Despite his claims, ticket machines ARE replacing booking offices at some stations.

And booking offices are closed sometimes. In these cases, the machines should be able to sell all tickets.

[Zoe]

Giving people the option to buy a ticket for any journey in Great Britain from a machine is going to cost the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) revenue as some people would take advantage of this and buy combinations of tickets so I can't see any TOC agreeing to this.

[Tim]

Giving people the option to buy a ticket for any journey in Great Britain from a machine is going to cost the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) revenue as some people would take advantage of this and buy combinations of tickets so I can't see any TOC agreeing to this.

You can already do this (in a way) if you book online and collect your tickets from a machine.

[Tim]

As much as I hate to stand in front of a booking office window trying to sort out cheapest fares I^m afraid that is the only thing to do until the ridiculous fares structure is sorted.

I have every sympathy with the staff, and other waiting passengers, as it took me the best part of 20 minutes running the options in my Ellesmere Port thread. Apparently you can^t split the single to Ellesmere from Bristol via Stoke so paid the separate tickets. And it was only after I said that I could get from Ellesmere to Newport for ^10 after a quote for ^32 (Newport/Filton is certainly less than ^22) did I get the price I was after. All told just over 40 quid for the round trip, from a minimum of ^59.30 for the Off peak return.

I've choose my tickets online and just hand the booking office staff a list so as to minimise delays.  The alternative of coures is to book online and collect tickets from the machine.  I try and avoid doing this though as I'd rather the booking staff were not replaced by machines although if I have enough time I book online and get the tickets posted to me which I suppose makes me inconsistant

[paul7575]

Giving people the option to buy a ticket for any journey in Great Britain from a machine is going to cost the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) revenue as some people would take advantage of this and buy combinations of tickets so I can't see any TOC agreeing to this.

Exactly - but I think it isn't really A-B-C combinations in particular they are worried about, I suspect they'll never allow it because it aids buying A-B-big gap-C-D tickets. A fraud known colloquially as dumbbelling.

E.g. if you went to a ticket office and asked for Southampton-St Denys and Vauxhall - Waterloo for example, I think they'd have a right to be a bit suspicious.  The commercial rules always have to consider the worst case fraudsters unfortunately...
Paul

[Tim]

Giving people the option to buy a ticket for any journey in Great Britain from a machine is going to cost the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) revenue as some people would take advantage of this and buy combinations of tickets so I can't see any TOC agreeing to this.

Exactly - but I think it isn't really A-B-C combinations in particular they are worried about, I suspect they'll never allow it because it aids buying A-B-big gap-C-D tickets. A fraud known colloquially as dumbbelling.

E.g. if you went to a ticket office and asked for Southampton-St Denys and Vauxhall - Waterloo for example, I think they'd have a right to be a bit suspicious.  The commercial rules always have to consider the worst case fraudsters unfortunately...
Paul

But you could buy your tickets online and still "dumbbell"