Cross Country industrial action - August 2009 (merged topics)

[whole diary]

[r james]

Whats the big issue about a train manager and retail service manager having to collect litter?  Surely isnt an issue on the long stretches of the XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) routes once tickets have been checked?

DO no cleaners get on at all now then?  Last time i travelled XC in July, a cleaner got on to pick up litter?

[John R]

Well seeing the state of standard class in HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s 2 hours out of London I can well understand why TM^‡(resolve)'s would not want it added to their job description. OK, different line I know, but litter collection is a grotty job at the best of times.

[smithy]

Whats the big issue about a train manager and retail service manager having to collect litter?  Surely isnt an issue on the long stretches of the XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) routes once tickets have been checked?

DO no cleaners get on at all now then?  Last time i travelled XC in July, a cleaner got on to pick up litter?

i still see the ISS cleaners getting on at btm,maybe they are just seeing out the contract?

[JayMac]

Whats the big issue about a train manager and retail service manager having to collect litter?  Surely isnt an issue on the long stretches of the XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) routes once tickets have been checked?

DO no cleaners get on at all now then?  Last time i travelled XC in July, a cleaner got on to pick up litter?

And I'm fairly certain I saw someone in an ISS uniform collecting litter between Cheltenham and Bristol a few weeks back. Have AXC^» (Arriva Cross Country - about) really dumped their ISS contract? Any conformation of this?

[JayMac]

edited to add: Anybody you see out on trains on a Sunday is on overtime, and can refuse to work.  If everybody throws in their Sundays, the trains don't run that day, and the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) concerned has to pay a large amount in fines for cancelled trains, compensation to ticket holders, replacement taxi's - buses, and bad publicity in The Times etc.  Quite a threat, especially as it doesn't "cost" the staff anything.  There must be a lot of ill-feeling at XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) that it has come to that, and that staff are prepared to give up the overtime to protect the jobs of their colleagues.

My God, it's the 21st century, and yet it appears from this quote that a Sunday rail service is only run on the goodwill of the frontline staff. "If everybody throws in their Sundays..." is less a threat and more a case of holding the TOC and ultimately the passenger to ransom. I can only surmise that the RMT^▸ (National Union of Rail, Maritime & Transport Workers) and its members don't want to have Sundays included in contracted hours as it might take away some lucrative overtime. In my last job I got sod-all extra for working a Sunday, just part of my shift pattern.

[devon_metro]

I work Sundays. Perhaps I should get in touch with the RMT^▸ (National Union of Rail, Maritime & Transport Workers)

[JayMac]

edited to add: Anybody you see out on trains on a Sunday is on overtime, and can refuse to work.  If everybody throws in their Sundays, the trains don't run that day, and the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) concerned has to pay a large amount in fines for cancelled trains, compensation to ticket holders, replacement taxi's - buses, and bad publicity in The Times etc.  Quite a threat, especially as it doesn't "cost" the staff anything.  There must be a lot of ill-feeling at XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) that it has come to that, and that staff are prepared to give up the overtime to protect the jobs of their colleagues.

My God, it's the 21st century, and yet it appears from this quote that a Sunday rail service is only run on the goodwill of the frontline staff.

Correct. What's your point?   

Umm.... my point is that Sundays should be part of contracted hours. Pay a bit more by all means...

So what is the deal with Sundays, do you get time off in lieu as well?

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

A total ban on litter-picking on trains..........they must have started this early! 

[r james]

So its definetly official that no cleaning contract will take place on the trains? 

So will a cleaner get on at the very end of the service, at the terminating station to clean properly?  Or willit just be left to get worse and worse?

WHo will restock the toilet paper etc>?

[Btline]

WHo will restock the toilet paper etc>?

We should call Brussels!

The EU^» (European Union - about) would have something to say - it's probably against our human rights to have no toilet paper in the loos...

[Mookiemoo]

Things like this are just archaic!

I have "colleagues" who have just been told 25% rate cut - take it or leave it.........................thing is - unionization would not help - we'd be replaced by indians. 

Live in the real world.  I wont be striking because of their rate cut - I'm negotiating a rate rise!

If my negotiating skills and my performance are good enough, I'll get it - if not, I wont.  Same applies to them.

And dont get me started on full out strikes - thats is why I have no sympathy.  You guys strike, I dont make it into work.  I dont give a crap about whether or not you hurt FGW^▸ (First Great Western) - are you going to reimburse me ^520 for loss of a days earnings?

[Mookiemoo]

Umm.... my point is that Sundays should be part of contracted hours. Pay a bit more by all means...

So what is the deal with Sundays, do you get time off in lieu as well?

No, just pay, so on a week you work Sunday you only have one day off.  We are rostered to work Sundays, but can refuse by the previous Wednesday if we choose. Some companies have arrangements by which it is up to the person refusing the Sunday to find their own cover, others that if you don't actively opt out of a Sunday then you have to work it.  It varies from TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) to TOC.  

Personally, I have always worked Sundays in previous jobs, so I work my rostered ones here, I usualy don't make myself unavailable unless I have something specific on, others have handed in letters saying they never want to work any Sundays - after all, it is one of the two days off a week, some people prefer to have two days a week off rather than one (how dare they have a life outside of work!).

If the TOC's were to make us an offer we can't refuse I'm sure most would accept it, but that would involve them hiring and training enough staff to cover all staff having two days a week off, so they are not prepared to put up that much cash either.  It's a two-way thing, not just the evil unions holding the poor TOC's to ransom.

Well what they should do is just have a rolling week - you get 2 days off - sundays fall into the pot.  BUT - you get paid sunday as if its a normal day - same as saturday.    Thats what most supermarket staff do.

I know people who would rather have, say, a friday and sat off - they can do stuff!

[Mookiemoo]

Things like this are just archaic!

I have "colleagues" who have just been told 25% rate cut - take it or leave it.........................thing is - unionization would not help - we'd be replaced by indians. 

Live in the real world.  I wont be striking because of their rate cut - I'm negotiating a rate rise!

If my negotiating skills and my performance are good enough, I'll get it - if not, I wont.  Same applies to them.

And dont get me started on full out strikes - thats is why I have no sympathy.  You guys strike, I dont make it into work.  I dont give a crap about whether or not you hurt FGW^▸ (First Great Western) - are you going to reimburse me ^520 for loss of a days earnings?

Firstly, it's not FGW that is going on strike, it's XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)). Secondly, it's probably less than you save with your dodgy YP card, so pull your neck in.

Its the RMT^▸ (National Union of Rail, Maritime & Transport Workers)!  And I dont ONLY use FGW!

And was there not an agreement about not starting arguments............... but if you want to go there I'm quite happy to - dont think the mods will be

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

You both have a valid point that could have been made in a more mature way.....

[JayMac]

Things like this are just archaic!

I have "colleagues" who have just been told 25% rate cut - take it or leave it.........................thing is - unionization would not help - we'd be replaced by indians. 

Live in the real world.  I wont be striking because of their rate cut - I'm negotiating a rate rise!

If my negotiating skills and my performance are good enough, I'll get it - if not, I wont.  Same applies to them.

And dont get me started on full out strikes - thats is why I have no sympathy.  You guys strike, I dont make it into work.  I dont give a crap about whether or not you hurt FGW^▸ (First Great Western) - are you going to reimburse me ^520 for loss of a days earnings?

Firstly, it's not FGW that is going on strike, it's XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)). Secondly, it's probably less than you save with your dodgy YP card, so pull your neck in.

Its the RMT^▸ (National Union of Rail, Maritime & Transport Workers)!  And I dont ONLY use FGW!

And was there not an agreement about not starting arguments............... but if you want to go there I'm quite happy to - dont think the mods will be

Now now children. That nasty Mod is gonna come along with his big stick if you are not careful......