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Author Topic: HS2 - Government proposals, alternative routes and general discussion  (Read 394059 times)
grahame
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« Reply #1110 on: December 16, 2020, 07:32:01 »

Press hit yesterday by suggested / potential changes to the eastern leg of HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) north of Birmingham.

From the BBC» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page)

Quote
Plans to downgrade HS2 "will short-change millions of people", transport lobby groups have said.

The National Infrastructure Commission (NIC) has suggested a series of options on the future of the high-speed line.

One option is a downgrading of the eastern side of Phase Two, linking Birmingham to Leeds, which could see it terminate at East Midlands Parkway station in Nottinghamshire.

Lobby group Midlands Connect said the plans were "very concerning".

Also discussions on regional rail enhancements.   

There is a massive unanswered question (crystal balls needed) as to whether regional / intermediate distance rail journeys will continue to be more robust in number than the long distance stuff. If the balance changes, should such a change in balance of use should result in funding and scope changes for HS2 and / or regional rail, and whether the two should be put together in an "either/or" linkage, or separated?
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« Reply #1111 on: December 16, 2020, 08:13:00 »

Press hit yesterday by suggested / potential changes to the eastern leg of HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) north of Birmingham.

From the BBC» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page)

Quote
Plans to downgrade HS2 "will short-change millions of people", transport lobby groups have said.

The National Infrastructure Commission (NIC) has suggested a series of options on the future of the high-speed line.

One option is a downgrading of the eastern side of Phase Two, linking Birmingham to Leeds, which could see it terminate at East Midlands Parkway station in Nottinghamshire.

Lobby group Midlands Connect said the plans were "very concerning".

Also discussions on regional rail enhancements.   

There is a massive unanswered question (crystal balls needed) as to whether regional / intermediate distance rail journeys will continue to be more robust in number than the long distance stuff. If the balance changes, should such a change in balance of use should result in funding and scope changes for HS2 and / or regional rail, and whether the two should be put together in an "either/or" linkage, or separated?

The NIC are suggesting one or the other.

HS2 will necessitate the improvements to regional lines to take advantage of what HS2 will offer, where as the NIC suggestion of scraping HS2 Eastern leg in favour of regional route improvement will only offer marginal improvements.


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« Reply #1112 on: December 16, 2020, 13:55:42 »

The NIC are suggesting one or the other.

HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) will necessitate the improvements to regional lines to take advantage of what HS2 will offer, where as the NIC suggestion of scraping HS2 Eastern leg in favour of regional route improvement will only offer marginal improvements.

This is the same sort of money saving idea that took the Bristol area's tram scheme and reduced it to a couple of new roads, a few new bus lanes without buses, and an express route to the climate emergency airport.
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CyclingSid
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« Reply #1113 on: December 17, 2020, 06:54:48 »

... and an aircraft carrier without aircraft.
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TonyK
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« Reply #1114 on: December 17, 2020, 10:03:32 »

... and an aircraft carrier without aircraft.

Is that this one? I don't think there has ever been an aircraft carrier that started life with aircraft on board. It just took a little longer than usual.  Smiley
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« Reply #1115 on: January 03, 2021, 16:56:20 »

......at the risk of being deafened by the reverberations of an echo chamber, I post this from today's Telegraph;  Smiley


Anti-HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) campaigners have united around a new push to see the controversial project scrapped amid falling demand during the coronavirus pandemic.

Richard Walker, the CEO (Chief Executive Officer) of Iceland and human rights lawyer Michael Mansfield QC are among signatories of a new petition calling for the Government to hold a new vote over the ?100bn project.

?The ?100bn+ HS2 vanity project did not show a return for the taxpayer even before Covid-19 blew all assumptions about the UK (United Kingdom)?s future travel needs out of the water,? Richard Walker said. ?Its cost to nature and the environment is completely unacceptable, and its supposed regional economic benefits illusory: it would simply suck more jobs and prosperity out of the North.

"We should ditch this white elephant now and invest in better cross-country rail links and high-speed broadband instead.?

Organisers believe the petition will reveal growing opposition against the rail project from across the country and say it has brought together different groups of anti-HS2 campaigners for the first time.

Rail demand has dipped during the pandemic as people work from home and avoid crowded public transport.

A report from the National Infrastructure Committee last month said that the eastern section of the high-speed network should be deferred and regional transport links developed instead.

Meanwhile, environmentalists have raised alarm at the destruction of ancient woodland along the

route, which is not expected to be complete until 2029.

An award-winning pear tree believed to have been at least 250 years, was cut down in Warwickshire in October.

Michael Mansfield said: ?HS2 has become a vanity project for politicians bereft of policy.

?You would have thought that, if nothing else, the message of the pandemic would have made it abundantly clear that this project unwanted and frankly irrelevant.

?Yet, the Government continue to insist on protecting it. Stop the endless exploitation of scarce environmental, economic and human resources.?

Esther McVey MP (Member of Parliament), who has long opposed the project, tweeted on Monday: ?As train passenger numbers have slumped, 1 in 5 rail services could be axed next year ?to prevent the taxpayers bill spiralling out of control? saving taxpayers ?7bn. In light of the above, can someone tell me why we?re not cancelling HS2 which would save taxpayers over ?100bn??

Among the petition?s backers are the naturalist and TV presenter Chris Packham and Doug Thornton the former head of property at HS2, who became a whistleblower on the project after warning about the rising costs in 2015. 

Mr Packham said: ?'In the face of our climate, environment and pandemic emergencies, our government and judiciary are failing us. Projects like HS2, Heathrow Airport's expansion and a vast new road building programme take us further away from where we need to be, and time is rapidly running out.

"The world has changed dramatically since MPs voted on HS2 back in 2016. HS2 takes us further away from achieving Net Zero by 2050, it destroys a vast swathe of irreplaceable wildlife habitats and squanders a colossal amount of taxpayer's money on a business case that was bankrupt even before Covid, and that has now spiralled to double the cost MPs voted upon.

"Add to this our economic crisis, and we can see that MPs should be given the power to reconsider HS2 and vote again on whether this disaster project should continue, be rethought, or scrapped entirely.? 

HS2 says that the high-speed trainline will have an overall positive impact on the environment by cutting the number of cars on the road and domestic flights.




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« Reply #1116 on: January 04, 2021, 11:57:17 »

I think we have said all there is to be said on the matter, except possibly one small detail. I wondered what award the "award winning tree" was awarded. I found that the Cubbington Pear Tree, as it was known prior to its demise, was voted "Best Tree in England" in 2015, shortly after it was announced that it would be cut down. I wondered if there was a chance that politics might have played a part, so did a bit more digging. The 2019 Tree of the Year awards, supported by the award-winning horticulturalist and TV personality David Domoney (no, I don't either), seemed to have a number of beauties among the contenders, according to the award-winning Guardian newspaper. I actually know one of them, and didn't realise that it had a back story of any interest. Nearly all of them seem to be more than just a tree in the traditional sense. Maybe the electorate were swayed by lobbying in 2016, or maybe the judges asked the same people who voted for Boaty McBoatface?

The 2020 Tree of the Year was the Happy Man Tree, according to the award-winning Woodland Trust, which runs the competition. It seems it may since been cut down. This leads me to think that trees threatened by the chainsaw have an unfair advantage at the hustings.

I wonder what will win the 2040 award for High Speed Railway of the Year?
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« Reply #1117 on: January 04, 2021, 12:55:37 »

I think TonyK deserves an award for that post Smiley
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« Reply #1118 on: January 04, 2021, 13:58:57 »

I wonder what will win the 2040 award for High Speed Railway of the Year?

S&D2, of course!
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« Reply #1119 on: January 28, 2021, 11:00:31 »

Fresh doubt over HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) branch to Leeds;

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/01/27/fresh-doubt-hs2-spur-leeds/


Fresh doubt has been cast over the fate of a £32bn branch of HS2 linking Birmingham with Leeds.

Ministers have ordered HS2 to alter the design of a new terminus at Euston station, board papers prepared by Transport for London reveal.

The proposed changes, which will reduce the number of platforms built at the London station from 11 to 10, would take place over one stage rather than two.

The Government insisted that the changes would not prevent all HS2 services running.

But Gareth Dennis, a rail engineer and transport lecturer, said this meant it was “very likely” that eastern leg was being “descoped”.

“Unbelievably bad news. This Government has bottled it,” he said on Twitter.

The Government’s own adviser, the National Infrastructure Commission, angered leaders in the north of England by calling for the HS2 spur to Leeds to be mothballed.

Upgrades to mainland services across the north and Midlands should be prioritised instead, the commission concluded in its report to Boris Johnson in December.

The eastern leg of HS2 has been dubbed the £98bn project’s “sacrificial lamb” by some officials within Whitehall.

Earlier this month Mr Johnson appeared to throw his support behind the HS2 branch to Leeds by saying Britain was “getting on” with planning for the spur.

But he responded to a question from Conservative MP (Member of Parliament) Pauline Latham in the Commons on Wednesday with only lukewarm support.

The member for mid-Derbyshire asked: “Can the prime minister commit to delivering the eastern leg of HS2 in full, creating 150,000 jobs and billions of pounds of investment in the north?”

Mr Johnson responded that Ms Latham was "right to be militating for the eastern leg of HS2. We will be publishing the Integrated Rail Plan early this year.”


William Barter, an independent rail consultant, said that while reducing the number of platforms at Euston from 11 to 10 may not appear to be drastic, it would significantly affect services by removing the “the first line of defence against trains arriving more than 10 minutes late”.

“I’m not sure the thinking at Euston is joined up with the eastern leg. It’s as likely as anything else that the Eastern leg is built, and then we discover the service on it has to be limited as Euston can’t handle all its trains,” he added.

“What to do at Euston seems to be driven by short-term cost savings, and maximising property development at the expense of the operational railway.

Mr Barter continued: “Reducing Euston can only devalue the whole project. The value of each train service is an order of magnitude greater than the reported cost pressure. No overall benefits arise compared with the existing service until HS2 trains can reach Euston, so delaying availability of any platforms until the whole scheme is complete both postpones direct benefits and frustrates exploiting released capacity on the classic line.”

A Department for Transport spokesman said: “A smaller HS2 station at Euston would not prevent the future operation of services on the HS2 eastern leg. The current focus of work is developing an optimised design and delivery strategy, which considers opportunities and efficiencies to address identified cost pressures.

“This includes exploring the potential for the station to be constructed in a single stage, helping reduce costs and risks. This work will inform the final design.”

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« Reply #1120 on: February 07, 2021, 12:57:48 »

I was interested to read this in a statement from the Green party last year, as quoted by member Taplow Green elsewhere:

Quote
We need projects that favour regional connectivity and help local people in their daily lives. We need to invest in new rail connections that remove bottlenecks, increase rail freight capacity, improve journey times and frequencies, enhance capacity in the South West, Midlands and North and join up currently unconnected urban areas.
Source: Jonathan Bartley responds to government’s decision to greenlight HS2 (The next High Speed line(s))

I look forward to seeing the detail of these projects. Presumably they can all be built without any damage to sensitive environments, and with zero construction emissions, for free.
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« Reply #1121 on: February 07, 2021, 14:48:46 »

I was interested to read this in a statement from the Green party last year, as quoted by member Taplow Green elsewhere:

Quote
We need projects that favour regional connectivity and help local people in their daily lives. We need to invest in new rail connections that remove bottlenecks, increase rail freight capacity, improve journey times and frequencies, enhance capacity in the South West, Midlands and North and join up currently unconnected urban areas.
Source: Jonathan Bartley responds to government’s decision to greenlight HS2 (The next High Speed line(s))

I look forward to seeing the detail of these projects. Presumably they can all be built without any damage to sensitive environments, and with zero construction emissions, for free.

Mr Bartley is, of course, right. We would only disagree on the issue of whether such investment would be in addition to or instead of HS2. Along the route, plans are afoot to improve connections with HS2, and these will benefit rail users within those areas generally. There is also now talk of making HS2 X-shaped, by improving the route from Birmingham to Bristol and Cardiff to allow through journeys by HS2 trains. There is an argument that HS2 is spurring on many rail improvements that would otherwise not have seen the light of day.

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« Reply #1122 on: February 11, 2021, 22:29:24 »

HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) West Midlands to Crewe has now passed in to law.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2021/2/pdfs/ukpga_20210002_en.pdf

Thanks Liz.
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« Reply #1123 on: February 12, 2021, 08:39:48 »

HS2 (The next High Speed line(s)) West Midlands to Crewe has now passed in to law.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2021/2/pdfs/ukpga_20210002_en.pdf

Thanks Liz.

La Reyne le veult - murky buckets!

I haven't read it all (honest!) but I had a quick scroll through to see the structure. Compared to the planning application for the MetroBust Bridge Over the M32, it is a beacon of clarity, with the work to be done broken down into bite sized chucks. There is reference to the plans for each part having been lodged with Parliament, which will be worth a look for anyone with a favourite tree in mind.
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« Reply #1124 on: February 15, 2021, 17:11:17 »

Short video showing some of the construction sites on the route.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-56045071

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