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ellendune
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« Reply #1306 on: February 08, 2023, 10:15:50 » |
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I am sceptical that delaying a project ever reduced costs. Delaying Euston to reduce costs seems to have actually increased costs as £100 million of design work is binned. Might I suggest that the cost here is measured in Conservative Party votes. Delaying in this context is delaying a decision that will upset some of their voters so that it is taken by another government, while not totally alienating those of their voters who want to see the project built. Even Christian Wolmar is now saying we have to finish the project to get the benefits. There are ways we can reduce costs on later stages without compromising on value. The ridiculous political stipulation that put over strict tolerances on subsidence in earth structures to limit future maintenance costs an absolute fortune because they essentially became concrete structures. Any decision to do this on later phases be justified by a separate economic appraisal looking at the balance of capital and on-going maintenance costs. |
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stuving
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« Reply #1307 on: February 08, 2023, 11:02:44 » |
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Also from New Civil Engineer: Chancellor declares vision for HS3, HS4 and HS5 despite cost concerns on HS2▸
Building a network of high speed rail links in the UK▸ is key to improving connectivity and delivering levelling up, according to Chancellor Jeremy Hunt.
Speaking at an All Party Parliamentary Group on Infrastructure (APPGI) reception at the ICE this week, Hunt said: “I really want to have HS3, HS4 and HS5. We have got to have much better connectivity.”
The revelation about his ambition to build a network of high speed rail link came as news that further cost concerns on High Speed 2 (HS2) could lead to scaling back of the eastern leg... |
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1308 on: February 08, 2023, 11:28:13 » |
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I am sceptical that delaying a project ever reduced costs. Delaying Euston to reduce costs seems to have actually increased costs as £100 million of design work is binned. Might I suggest that the cost here is measured in Conservative Party votes. Delaying in this context is delaying a decision that will upset some of their voters so that it is taken by another government, while not totally alienating those of their voters who want to see the project built. Even Christian Wolmar is now saying we have to finish the project to get the benefits. There are ways we can reduce costs on later stages without compromising on value. The ridiculous political stipulation that put over strict tolerances on subsidence in earth structures to limit future maintenance costs an absolute fortune because they essentially became concrete structures. Any decision to do this on later phases be justified by a separate economic appraisal looking at the balance of capital and on-going maintenance costs. £100 million in the HS2 context is a drop in the ocean. As for benefits, the HS2 benefit-cost ratio has been steadily falling since 2010......with ever increasing costs and construction inflation at around 20% that's unlikely to change. Overall cost forecast now North of £150 billion. There must be a colossal temptation to slash and burn which may yet prove irrestible (I suspect this drives much of the speculation?) You might suggest it, but to be honest, given the number of voters who actively want to see it built being so low, I doubt the Government are worried on that score, however the number of votes they could garner with more hospitals etc may make them sit up and take notice, even if dressing it up as a benefit of a saving on a largely unpopular and vastly expensive rail scheme would be arguably disingenuous. .......but as New Civil Engineer has highlighted, we may yet have HS▸ 3,4 & 5 to come!  |
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1309 on: February 11, 2023, 16:36:47 » |
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ellendune
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« Reply #1310 on: February 11, 2023, 19:03:46 » |
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Opponents of the scheme keep 'leaking' such news; most recently the 'leak' that Euston is to be cancelled, that was swiftly denied. It seem that opposing MP▸ 's and others wish to curry favour with their supporters. Why should I believe this so called leak? The more bit you prune off the worse the BCR▸ ! |
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TonyK
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Posts: 6438
The artist formerly known as Four Track, Now!
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« Reply #1311 on: February 11, 2023, 20:03:14 » |
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Opponents of the scheme keep 'leaking' such news; most recently the 'leak' that Euston is to be cancelled, that was swiftly denied. It seem that opposing MP▸ 's and others wish to curry favour with their supporters. Why should I believe this so called leak?
The more bit you prune off the worse the BCR▸ !
This rumour has a bit more body to it. Today's Times reports: Ministers are to order a review into the entire HS2▸ project amid mounting pressure to rein in ballooning costs.
Insiders said the Department for Transport (DfT» ) was poised to commission HS2 Ltd, the government-owned company asked to deliver the line, to re-evaluate the scheme.
The assessment will examine axing proposed stretches of the line or delaying completion of the project.
Options to be considered include further delays to completion of phases as well as scrapping the 40-mile stretch of line from Birmingham to East Midlands Parkway, near Nottingham. It will also examine axing the section north of Crewe and instead running trains into Manchester on existing tracks. The opening of the section from Old Oak Common, west London, to Euston could also be delayed. (continues at source, possibly behind a paywall) Asking HS2 Ltd to report on the scheme sounds like asking me to investigate why the drinks budget spiralled out of control, but they won't have to call so many witnesses as any other form of inquiry would, and can probably knock the whole thing off for the price of reopening a short branch line. There are important questions relating to the benefit/cost ratio that the government will want answers to such as: * Can we manage with what railway we already have, plus a few buses? * Will we lose a lot of votes? * Will we gain any votes? * Will it make us look stupid on French TV? * Will it upset Nicola Sturgeon? * Can we blame it all on Liz Truss? If there are more yes answers than noes. the benefit outweighs the cost, and the government can move on to develop a core strategy to shift any unpopular decisions to after the next election. It's important to remember that there are no universally popular answers here, even if the majority of votes in a nationwide ballot would be "whatever". These will be busy times at the Department for Procrastination and Obfuscation. |
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Now, please!
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ChrisB
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« Reply #1312 on: February 17, 2023, 19:08:46 » |
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From The GrauniadBirmingham’s singing station clock – a platform for ‘ordinary’ voices Aural clock, designed by Turner prize winner Susan Philipz for Curzon Street HS2▸ station, features sounds made by 1,092 city folk
“I think your voice would suit an F sharp. So that will be six o’clock,” said composer Andy Ingamells as he listened to my feeble attempts to sing Dolly Parton’s 9 to 5, my go-to karaoke song.
He is in the process of recording the voices of 1,092 ordinary people from across Birmingham and Solihull so they can be immortalised in the chimes of a singing station clock, which will be placed in the centre of the HS2 railway station being built in the city.
The large-scale aural clock, designed by Turner prize winner Susan Philipsz, will sound every hour and each chime will be represented by a musical note, starting at 12 o’clock with C sharp.
Birmingham Big Art Project, which is gathering the voices, says no singing experience is required and it has recorded volunteers aged from three to 93.
“So many of the people who have come in said they can’t sing,” said Ingamells.
“But everyone can make a sound with their voice. We’re going to have a real mix of different colours and timbres, and I think that is what makes this project different – we haven’t just used trained singers where the voices would blend more easily.
“We don’t want the voices to be anonymous. These are real people and these are their real voices, so it’s important that comes across.”
Gavin Wade, director of Eastside Projects, which is the commissioning agent for the project, said the team tried hard to avoid a conveyor belt of recording sessions.
“We wanted to get people from all the wards across the city, all walks of life, all ethnicities – bring everyone together through this – but to do it with depth and sincerity, and to connect to people genuinely,” he said. “And people have been fascinated by it.”
The recording process, in a booth at Royal Birmingham Conservatoire, was simple. After I demonstrated my (limited) vocal capacity with my chosen song, Ingamells guided me in sounding out long F sharp notes – some sung softly, some loudly.
These will then be combined with many other F sharp notes to make up the sixth chime as part of an aural composition that builds to a vibrant chorus every day at noon.
“We’ve already filled our quota of Cs and Bs, so we’re trying to challenge people to try other notes,” he said.
In the recording studio, Ingamells played a sample chime taken from previous recordings. It starts with the piercing note of a heavy metal singer and ends with the soft sounds of a child’s voice.
Recording for the clock started in 2019 but was hampered by the pandemic, which led to strict restrictions on singing.
By the time it is installed in the newly built Curzon Street station, which is anticipated to be in 2028, the clock will have become a time capsule for those who took part.
“We’ve recorded some elderly people who are no longer with us, and young children who will have become teenagers and sound completely different,” said Ingamells.
Some of his fondest memories of the project so far include the teenage boys who came in and rapped their own lyrics to warm up their vocal cords and the little girl who was at first too shy to sing, and whose voice they captured from the final note of Twinkle, Twinkle, Little Star.
“For a lot of people, it’s been their first time in a recording studio. It’s been really nice to see people come in and see that the records they listen to every day, the music on the radio, this is how it’s made,” he said.
The finished result will be a large sonic sculpture, the biggest piece of public art in Birmingham, with speakers for each note spread out in a large circle representing the clock and possibly a plaque showing the names of each singer.
“We wanted to create something new and unique in the world,” said Wade.
“Something that only Birmingham has that tells the story of the city and creates a brand-new experience that people will come to visit.”
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Electric train
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« Reply #1313 on: February 18, 2023, 07:54:43 » |
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Opponents of the scheme keep 'leaking' such news; most recently the 'leak' that Euston is to be cancelled, that was swiftly denied. It seem that opposing MP▸ 's and others wish to curry favour with their supporters. Why should I believe this so called leak? The more bit you prune off the worse the BCR▸ ! I can see services into Euston being delayed, with the redevelopment of the Euston and Camden area continuing because that's where the payback money is, HS2▸ into Euston could be 10 years or more after Old Oak Common opens with in effect HS2 having to earn the revenue to complete it. The section North of Crewe may be cut back, but there is a political element regarding union of the UK▸ message this may send to Scotland as one of the key part of going North of Crewe is reducing journey times to Glasgow, both major parties in the lead up to the next General Election will be keen to show they have a form of "levelling up" in their manifestos |
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Starship just experienced what we call a rapid unscheduled disassembly, or a RUD, during ascent,”
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stuving
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« Reply #1315 on: February 20, 2023, 11:39:38 » |
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Not mysterious at all. And work on HS2 halted? Well, one TBM has paused, if that's the same thing. The Guardian's full text had (partly missing* from MSN's copy): When the contractors saw what was happening, they sealed off the area and started extra ground monitoring with the aim of preventing subsidence resulting from the leak. Additional ground anchors are being installed to protect against subsidence.
The contractors believe the leak was the result of an existing borehole, which caused slurry to travel up the borehole and pool on the surface. They will continue to monitor the area over the next few days. So, it was a leak - slurry is used by some TBMs, and it's under pressure to stop the ground collapsing before the linings are in place. I think this is the first drive on which HS2 have used the method - it depends on the nature of the ground. It escaped up some pre-existing channel, such as a borehole (a terrafistula?); ground surveys can't be expected to spot that. Once the TBM has got past it (maybe they drop the pressure a bit for a while) and whatever sort of grout they use around the linings has set - end of problem. * It is there - but you have to click on the blue button to see it. |
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« Last Edit: February 20, 2023, 12:41:37 by stuving »
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stuving
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« Reply #1317 on: February 20, 2023, 12:08:01 » |
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Also, if the hole was pre-existing the tunnelling, where is any concern that at any time, rugby players may have disappeared in the other direction?....   "Borehole" covers a wide range of purposes and diameters, but even the bigger ones you'd struggle to get a small rugby player (if there is such a thing these days) down. But, thinking of who might have been drilling such a thing recently - I wonder if it might be one of HS2▸ 's own? No doubt the surveyors would have recorded their exact positions, but would that level of precision have been passed through the project (involving several companies) and be known to the drillers? And if it was, I doubt they would have diverted to avoid it - more likely just rely on dealing with it as just one of those little things you cope with as and when. |
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TonyK
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Posts: 6438
The artist formerly known as Four Track, Now!
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« Reply #1318 on: February 20, 2023, 13:07:38 » |
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I wondered where MSN got this from. It sounds a lot more Guardian than Microsoft, with its default view that technological advances will kill us all, especially anything to do with nuclear power or HS2. Turns out it was the Guardian after all. Panic over - nothing that can't be fixed with a pack of kitchen roll. |
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Now, please!
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Mark A
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« Reply #1319 on: February 20, 2023, 14:49:46 » |
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This puts me in mind of the work to stabilise Bath's stone mines. Much injection of foamed concrete, and at one point a hasty extension of the work day when a resident returned home to find the ground floor of their house filling up with said material.
Mark
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