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Author Topic: Great Western Railway: on-board catering, buffets, Travelling Chef, Pullman - ongoing discussion  (Read 537356 times)
IndustryInsider
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« Reply #1650 on: September 10, 2021, 07:03:44 pm »

LNER» (London North Eastern Railway - about) also offer food & drink delivery to Standard class. Nothing from GWR (Great Western Railway) yet that I’ve seen. Possibky difficult with 5car sets when run as 10cars as would need 2 additional staff

It was definitely at the advanced planning stage, see post #1576, but I’ve not heard anything recently.
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To view my GWML (Great Western Main Line) Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/
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« Reply #1651 on: September 10, 2021, 09:31:48 pm »

Just as a postscript.  I’m glad I wasn’t in the evening Pullman from Plymouth tonight.  It’s running almost three hours late because of the points failure at Keyham. 
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broadgage
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« Reply #1652 on: September 11, 2021, 08:35:28 am »

Good to see the 9-cars being used on some of the Pullmans now - better for passengers than a 2x5-car and a slightly bigger kitchen for the staff as well.

When the IETs (Intercity Express Train) were being introduced, I stated that a pair of 5 car units were not suitable for Pullman dining for various reasons, and at the time IET supporters said that 9 car units would "presumably be used" for Pullman services and suggested that my talk of 5 car units was unduly negative.

Then 5 car units became the norm, due it was reported to Penzance depot being unable to accept full length trains.

Yet now we ARE getting 9 cars to Cornwall. A belated positive move, but what has changed ?
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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« Reply #1653 on: September 11, 2021, 09:19:15 am »

Whether it is the main reason for the change I don't know but GWR (Great Western Railway) did state there had been some time-keeping issues with coupling and splitting at Plymouth.  We have also seen reports of high passenger numbers so additional capacity would be sensible.
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bignosemac
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« Reply #1654 on: November 12, 2021, 06:43:32 pm »

Are you missing HST (High Speed Train) buffets?  Tongue

Here's a 'new' one. On the Midland Pullman HST set.



And... cue broadgage.  Grin
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http://www.templecombevillage.uk/station.html

There is a rumour going around that I have found God. I think this is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist. - Sir Terry Pratchett
TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1655 on: November 12, 2021, 08:27:55 pm »

Broadgage will be drooling!
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GBM
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« Reply #1656 on: November 13, 2021, 08:16:36 am »





And... cue broadgage.  Grin

That's some blue!  Nurse, my shades  Cool
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Personal opinion only.  Writings not representative of any union, collective, management or employer. (Think that absolves me...........)
broadgage
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« Reply #1657 on: November 13, 2021, 12:52:53 pm »

Very impressive, but surely a trolley would be so much better better, a survey showed this to be the case. A static trolley would presumably be better still.

More seriously, I do wonder it is always that blue ? The effect is almost certainly obtained from LED light tape which is often multi colour.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
1st fan
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« Reply #1658 on: November 28, 2021, 02:58:33 am »

I can live without a Pullman Breakfast but not without bacon rolls. LNER» (London North Eastern Railway - about) and West Coast can provide them, and deliver to your seat in standard class so why not GWR (Great Western Railway)??

Years ago when it was admitted that the new trains would not have have buffets, a number of grand promises were made about the trolley service.
"improved trolleys that keep hot things hot and cold things cold"
"hot food served at ones seat in standard class"

In fact none of this was regularly achieved, a brief trial was undertaken of hot food, including bacon rolls,  in standard class but produced the expected result that it was not viable.
GWR cant even cope with reliably providing a very basic trolley.



The exact wording was http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=15945.msg179136#msg179136

Quote from: BenRule
I think many of the concerns you mention are based on the idea that somehow we think we can deliver this service with something similar to the current trolleys. We can't.
There are plenty of more sophisticated trolleys on the market that keep things hot, and keep things cool, and even serve a proper cup of coffee. A quick google will give you some idea.

I was willing to give it the benefit of doubt and wait and see what appeared on the new trains. I did have my doubts that there would be any difference between the new ones and the trolley on a Thames Turbo but waited to see. The ones I saw on Google were vastly more improved and even had a proper coffee machine on them which boded well. Low and behold they were almost exactly the same when they turned up onboard. I don't like the idea that we were misled and the service has been reduced to a fraction of what it was. I accept that there needs to be more capacity on services and therefore the buffet had to go. Personally speaking I couldn't care less whether it's a static/moving trolley or a buffet except for the fact that there's now no hot food outside of a Pullman service. There's probably little appetite to bother given the current pandemic situation. As happened recently I finished work late and made it to Paddington with just enough time to board. As I hadn't eaten for most of the day most disappointed to find that there was nothing I could eat off the trolley outside of snack food such as chocolate bars and crisps. There was an explanation given about issues with supply at Paddington, or that the incoming train had been late and it hadn't been restocked (can't remember). Either of those could have happened to a buffet too. Though even if the trolley is fully stocked it's got less of a range than the buffet used to.

My friend who has a caffeine addiction/is a coffee snob seriously dislikes instant with a passion. She says it's criminal that they were able to do away with the coffee machines that used to be on the HST (High Speed Train). She wants to know why the coffee couldn't be done with a Nespresso/coffee machine plugged in to a power socket on the trolley.  A trip down to the South West is not pleasant for her and she finds 3,4,5 hours without an espresso hell on earth. She knows it's an addiction and she's fine with that, just not with the inability to get a decent coffee. She has been known to get off the train and get a coffee then get back on the next service going to the same place. 
« Last Edit: November 28, 2021, 03:12:46 am by 1st fan » Logged
TaplowGreen
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« Reply #1659 on: November 28, 2021, 08:08:10 am »

I can live without a Pullman Breakfast but not without bacon rolls. LNER» (London North Eastern Railway - about) and West Coast can provide them, and deliver to your seat in standard class so why not GWR (Great Western Railway)??

Years ago when it was admitted that the new trains would not have have buffets, a number of grand promises were made about the trolley service.
"improved trolleys that keep hot things hot and cold things cold"
"hot food served at ones seat in standard class"

In fact none of this was regularly achieved, a brief trial was undertaken of hot food, including bacon rolls,  in standard class but produced the expected result that it was not viable.
GWR cant even cope with reliably providing a very basic trolley.



The exact wording was http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=15945.msg179136#msg179136

Quote from: BenRule
I think many of the concerns you mention are based on the idea that somehow we think we can deliver this service with something similar to the current trolleys. We can't.
There are plenty of more sophisticated trolleys on the market that keep things hot, and keep things cool, and even serve a proper cup of coffee. A quick google will give you some idea.



My friend who has a caffeine addiction/is a coffee snob seriously dislikes instant with a passion. She says it's criminal that they were able to do away with the coffee machines that used to be on the HST (High Speed Train). She wants to know why the coffee couldn't be done with a Nespresso/coffee machine plugged in to a power socket on the trolley.  A trip down to the South West is not pleasant for her and she finds 3,4,5 hours without an espresso hell on earth. She knows it's an addiction and she's fine with that, just not with the inability to get a decent coffee. She has been known to get off the train and get a coffee then get back on the next service going to the same place. 

A strong contender for First World problem of the year! :-)
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broadgage
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« Reply #1660 on: November 28, 2021, 10:03:33 am »

Indeed the lack of decent coffee, or any other proper catering could be described as a first world problem.
However the UK (United Kingdom) is still a first world nation, in which one might reasonably expect that trains would have buffets, and also padded seats, and suitable stowage for cycles, surfboards and holiday luggage. One might even hope for full length trains.

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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
1st fan
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« Reply #1661 on: November 28, 2021, 01:03:30 pm »

I can live without a Pullman Breakfast but not without bacon rolls. LNER» (London North Eastern Railway - about) and West Coast can provide them, and deliver to your seat in standard class so why not GWR (Great Western Railway)??

Years ago when it was admitted that the new trains would not have have buffets, a number of grand promises were made about the trolley service.
"improved trolleys that keep hot things hot and cold things cold"
"hot food served at ones seat in standard class"

In fact none of this was regularly achieved, a brief trial was undertaken of hot food, including bacon rolls,  in standard class but produced the expected result that it was not viable.
GWR cant even cope with reliably providing a very basic trolley.



The exact wording was http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=15945.msg179136#msg179136

Quote from: BenRule
I think many of the concerns you mention are based on the idea that somehow we think we can deliver this service with something similar to the current trolleys. We can't.
There are plenty of more sophisticated trolleys on the market that keep things hot, and keep things cool, and even serve a proper cup of coffee. A quick google will give you some idea.



My friend who has a caffeine addiction/is a coffee snob seriously dislikes instant with a passion. She says it's criminal that they were able to do away with the coffee machines that used to be on the HST (High Speed Train). She wants to know why the coffee couldn't be done with a Nespresso/coffee machine plugged in to a power socket on the trolley.  A trip down to the South West is not pleasant for her and she finds 3,4,5 hours without an espresso hell on earth. She knows it's an addiction and she's fine with that, just not with the inability to get a decent coffee. She has been known to get off the train and get a coffee then get back on the next service going to the same place. 

A strong contender for First World problem of the year! :-)

Yes I know, except she's travelled to a fair few developing countries in her career and travelled by train within them. She's had what she considered to be decent freshly ground coffee on a train in a fair few of those. It staggers her that we went so backwards in the name of progress in what's offered on a train to the South West. It has gone from freshly ground Americano, Cappuccino, Cafe Latte & Espresso to "bloody instant". It's to do with the volatile oils that are released when the beans are ground that are lost not long after grinding or something like that.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2021, 02:12:28 pm by 1st fan » Logged
broadgage
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« Reply #1662 on: November 28, 2021, 03:01:30 pm »

I do not believe that any TOC (Train Operating Company) takes trolley provision seriously, a trolley is more regarded as an interim step between a proper buffet, and the long term aim of nothing.

I can remember buffets on Waterloo services, then replaced by a trolley and now by nothing.

Trains to Brighton used to have buffets, then a trolley, and now nothing.


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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU (Diesel Multiple Unit) is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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