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« Reply #210 on: July 28, 2012, 23:11:53 » |
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In the summer if I have the choice I will avoid 166's the most practical thing FGW▸ could have done during the refresh was to have replaced all of the windows in the 166 with one with hopper vents like the 165's.
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Starship just experienced what we call a rapid unscheduled disassembly, or a RUD, during ascent,”
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #211 on: July 29, 2012, 01:56:22 » |
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The annoying thing is, not mentioning it for the first time in this thread, the new air-con system is much better and would work the majority of the time if windows were kept shut. However, with passenger opened windows it is usually rendered useless as soon as someone decides to open one of them. The best air-conditioning in the world would struggle to keep a Turbo carriage cool with 8 windows wide open, and it seems that prolonged running with the windows open makes the system give up, so that even if you close the windows you have to reboot the system for it to start cooling properly again.
Hence the suggestion that what is being done on 166206 might be at least trialled for the rest of the fleet to see if the passengers prefer it, and not prove that the system does work to make sure the manufacturers receive their pay check.
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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Jonathan H
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« Reply #212 on: July 29, 2012, 07:46:01 » |
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This is good news and, if I were the manufacturer of an air conditioning system I'd want to prove that it works otherwise it rather defeats the point of changing it.
I am aboard 166209 on the second service out of Gatwick this morning - first working of its day - rear coach air conditioning is working fine yet three windows were open when I boarded, presumably either because of passenger action or because the handles are loose. I hope locking the windows leads to something better.
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Btline
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« Reply #213 on: July 29, 2012, 13:36:51 » |
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The sooner FGW▸ do what Chiltern do the better.
*Install a system that works
*Seal the windows shut. None of this silly tape. Either replace with solid glass or lock them shut. (preferably the former)
Travelling on the Chiltern Turbo is a pleasant experience in the Summer.
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broadgage
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« Reply #214 on: July 29, 2012, 14:21:35 » |
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I cant support fitting permanently sealed windows to these, or indeed any trains.
Even the best air conditioning can fail, as can the engine or other power source that drives the air conditioning.
Being able to open the windows in such circumstances is important and on a hot day could be a lifesaver.
The windows should of course be secured shut normally so as to allow the air conditioning to work properly.
Ideally the windows should be electricly locked as I suggested in an earlier post.
If this is considered to be too complicated, then at least fit locks that require a carriage key to open them, as has been done on the class 159s.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU▸ is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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johoare
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« Reply #215 on: July 29, 2012, 17:28:04 » |
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So how do Chiltern/ SWT▸ etc get away with having sealed windows then? I think it's because their air conditioning is far superior to First Great Western's  |
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #216 on: July 29, 2012, 17:45:22 » |
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So how do Chiltern/ SWT▸ etc get away with having sealed windows then? I think it's because their air conditioning is far superior to First Great Western's SWT's 159s and the 158s were built that way. As they were not going to work Driver Only Operated routes the Guard could always be on hand to open the locked windows if the air-con failed. As for Chiltern, they could justify spending much more money on their refresh as they hold the franchise for another 10 years, not (potenially) another 1 year! See reply #65 to this thread. |
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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lordgoata
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« Reply #217 on: July 31, 2012, 09:24:10 » |
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166206 has had all the hopper windows locked shut.
I was on this last night, and it was a hell of a lot better than before - definitely made an improvement, although it wasn't exactly hot yesterday! |
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adc82140
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« Reply #218 on: August 09, 2012, 15:57:15 » |
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Travelled on 166206 this morning. Yes, it's cooler on board, but the condensation was dripping steadily from the ceiling panels. The carpet was somewhat soggy in places.
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #219 on: August 10, 2012, 13:54:21 » |
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Yes, dripping water from the ceiling has also been a bit of a problem with the new system, and the power required (as 'insider' mentioned in another thread) means that if it is working full pelt in all three vehicles then there is a noticeable drop in engine power of around 15% which makes keeping time rather more difficult - not sure if there's an easy cure to that one!
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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Electric train
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« Reply #220 on: August 10, 2012, 17:06:06 » |
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Yes, dripping water from the ceiling has also been a bit of a problem with the new system, and the power required (as 'insider' mentioned in another thread) means that if it is working full pelt in all three vehicles then there is a noticeable drop in engine power of around 15% which makes keeping time rather more difficult - not sure if there's an easy cure to that one!
Cure both problems by removing the aircon and fitting 165 drop vent to all widows |
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Starship just experienced what we call a rapid unscheduled disassembly, or a RUD, during ascent,”
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JayMac
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« Reply #221 on: August 10, 2012, 18:09:52 » |
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Cure both problems by removing the aircon and fitting 165 drop vent to all widows
What about women whose husbands are still alive?    |
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"Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for the rest of the day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
- Sir Terry Pratchett.
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Btline
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« Reply #222 on: August 11, 2012, 09:20:57 » |
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How exactly does opening a window and letting hot air from outside in help?
Yes, there is a breeze when the train is moving, but not when the train is stationary.
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broadgage
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« Reply #223 on: August 11, 2012, 09:45:07 » |
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If there is no functioning air conditioning, then opening a window is better than leaving it closed.
If the air conditioning has been defective for some time, or if none is fitted, then outside air will normally be less hot than that inside.
Without ventilation or air conditioning the inside air will rapidly become very humid, this makes it feel hotter still since high humdity impairs the natural cooling of the human body.
Air conditioning reduces not only the temperature but also the humidity (unless already low), therefore in the absence of funtioning air conditioning, opening of windows will reduce excessive humidity.
At high temperatures, moving air is more comfortable than still air, and again in the absence of working air conditioning the opening of windows helps.
On a moving train, considerable internal airflow results and conditions might be acceptable even on a hot day. When stopped there will still be a slight air movement, better than nothing.
Old trains with numerous large opening windows were relatively comfortable without air conditioning, at least when moving. The drawbacks being the admission of noise and dirt, and in steam days smoke from the engine.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU▸ is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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bobbyorson
Newbie
Posts: 8
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« Reply #224 on: August 11, 2012, 10:39:28 » |
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Chiltern Units don't have air conditioning but air chillers. Makes them easier and quicker to replace when the go wrong.
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