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All across the Great Western territory => The Wider Picture in the United Kingdom => Topic started by: old original on February 08, 2022, 22:10:27



Title: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: old original on February 08, 2022, 22:10:27
Some chunky fines handed down at Plymouth magistrates yesterday...

https://www.falmouthpacket.co.uk/news/19908508.three-people-fined-fare-dodging-trains-cornwall/


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: TonyK on February 09, 2022, 18:43:41
Some chunky fines handed down at Plymouth magistrates yesterday...

https://www.falmouthpacket.co.uk/news/19908508.three-people-fined-fare-dodging-trains-cornwall/


All in absentia too. That probably means the defendants weren't taking it seriously. I have seen that come back to bite someone on the bottom, quite severely, when out of the blue a check was made for an entirely unrelated matter, leading to said person being arrested on the warrant and spending a warm Easter weekend behind bars.


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on February 08, 2025, 19:38:52
This is all in the public domain, from the Falmouth Packet (https://www.falmouthpacket.co.uk/news/19908508.three-people-fined-fare-dodging-trains-cornwall/).  I'm posting here, in more detail:

Quote

Three people from Cornwall have been fined for dodging fares at Truro station on three separate occasions in September of last year.

The offences took place between September 3 - 21 and were all dealt with on the same day - Monday February 7 - at Plymouth District Magistrates' Court.

On Friday, September 3, Zoe Metters, 40, of Pydar Street in Truro, was found guilty of travelling on a First Great Western train at Truro without paying the £6 fare.

She was fined £440 for the offence and was made to pay compensation of £6 as well as pay a surcharge to fund victim services of £66 and costs of £180.

Metters was also found guilty of unacceptable behaviour on the railway for using threatening, abusive, obscene or offensive language and was fined a further £220.

Then, on Wednesday, September 15, Connor Fox, 18, of Dudnance Lane in Redruth, travelled at Truro without paying a fare of £12.10.

Fox was fined £440 for the offence and was made to pay compensation of £12.10 as well as pay a surcharge to fund victim services of £44 and costs of £180.

Finally, on Tuesday, September 21, Nick Lawrence, 31, of Poltair Avenue in St Austell was found guilty of travelling on a First Great Western train at Truro without paying the £6.80 fare.

Lawrence was fined £440 for the offence and was made to pay compensation of £6.80 as well as pay a surcharge to fund victim services of £44 and costs of £180.

All the offences were proved in the defendants' absences.


Their respective rail fares involved were £6.00, £12.10 and £6.80.  Was their 'dodging the fare' worth it?



Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: TonyK on February 11, 2025, 19:59:52

Their respective rail fares involved were £6.00, £12.10 and £6.80.  Was their 'dodging the fare' worth it?



And again, they didn't show at court. They had better pay up before a warrant is issued.


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: Marlburian on February 12, 2025, 11:06:57
What is the success rate for such fines being paid?


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: TaplowGreen on February 12, 2025, 14:53:01
What is the success rate for such fines being paid?

Probably very low.



Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on February 12, 2025, 14:58:08
Agreed - but it will still show up on their credit reference, surely?  ::)


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: Witham Bobby on February 12, 2025, 15:30:03
Agreed - but it will still show up on their credit reference, surely?  ::)

Only if the fine is not paid and recovery action leading to a County Court Judgement, or petition for bankruptcy is involved


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: TaplowGreen on February 13, 2025, 11:45:10
Agreed - but it will still show up on their credit reference, surely?  ::)

Some people are in such a financial mess with debts, arrears, fines, CCJs etc especially in the current climate that another one makes little difference, it's just added to the pile.

Their credit rating is amongst the least of their worries in this context.


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: rogerw on February 13, 2025, 11:56:25
Criminal court fines are not enforced through the County Courts. Enforcement of these is by threat of. or actual, imprisonment. If no attempt is made to pay an arrest warrant is issued, thus ensuring attendance at court


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: TaplowGreen on February 13, 2025, 13:39:53
Criminal court fines are not enforced through the County Courts. Enforcement of these is by threat of. or actual, imprisonment. If no attempt is made to pay an arrest warrant is issued, thus ensuring attendance at court

Unfortunately the rail industry managed to make a balls of that too......

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cyx0p18kq74o


Title: Re: Fare dodging fines imposed by Plymouth magistrates - February 2022
Post by: TonyK on February 14, 2025, 16:44:04

Unfortunately the rail industry managed to make a balls of that too......

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cyx0p18kq74o

Not all down to them - Magistrates' clerks should have spotted the issue too. I didn't know about this bit of legislation so I looked it up.

I found a common denominator between rail and justice system in the persona of Chris Grayling - remember him? Rhymes with "failing"? He introduced the Criminal Justice and Courts Act 2015 during his stint as Lord Chancellor, along with other measures panned by Lord Pannick on behalf of the rest of us. He was moved to the transport brief, presumably in the hope that things would improve or at least not get much worse. Handing a contract for shipping to a company with no ships was a sign of misplaced confidence.

I digress. I think the issue is that the single justice procedure - allowing the case to be decided by a single magistrate on the basis of documents alone, as opposed to a bench in open court - can only be applied to summary matters not punishable by imprisonment. Some rail companies used the Regulation of Railways Act 1889 as the basis of the charge, issuing a single justice notice at the same time rather than a summons to court. Section 5(3) of that act, however, has a maximum penalty of imprisonment for 3 months. Schoolboy error. Those companies who went the old fashioned way, with the defendant being summonsed to appear before open court, did not have the same problem.

If any of the people fined by Plymouth Magistrates on 7 February are reading this in the hope of finding a loophole, sorry. That was open court. Pay up, or expect a knock on the door at an unseemly hour by a couple of people in uniform with a warrant.



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