Great Western Coffee Shop

Does anyone know what the new timetables are like?

Are there any improvements?

If past form is anything to go by they should be online by the end of this week, a month out from the TT change on the 17th of May.

I can tell you that there will be a "bumper" timetable...

 ;D

I did not like the way they split the timetables last time.  I was even going to type out my own easier to read timetable but could not do due to copyright.

London to Devon & Cornwall is one of the books.

I got my new one :)

Timetable 7

If I recall the brief correctly there will be 40 different publications.

Is that the one to be kept behind ticket office desks and has to be paid for?  *opens can of worms and legs it*  ;D

I wouldn't have thought that FGW would bother suing you for copyright infringment if the timetable was just for yoru own use and you were not distributing them to others (and how would they know anyway?)

^2.50 I believe...

Is this a FGW publication similar to SWT's complete timetable?

Are FGW doing a complete overhaul of their timetables by splitting the current A-E books into smaller booklets?

Along with some changes to weekend First:

1 London to Bath, Bristol and Weston-super-Mare
2 London to South Wales
3 London and Swindon to Cheltenham
4 London to Devon and Cornwall
5 London and Reading to Newbury and Bedwyn
6 London and Reading to Basingstoke
7 Paddington to Reading fast services
8 Paddington to Reading local services
9 Slough to Reading
10 Oyster PAYG area
11 London to Slough and Windsor
12 Maidenhead to Marlow
13 Twyford to Henley
14 London and Reading to Didcot and Swindon
15 London and Reading to Didcot (fast services)
16 London and Reading to Oxford (fast services)
17 London to Oxford local services
18 Oxford to Banbury and Bicester
19 London to Worcester and Hereford
20 Reading to Gatwick
21 Heathrow Railair
22 Bristol to Worcester
23 Cheltenham to Gloucester
24 Cardiff and Bristol to Weston s Mare and Exeter
25 Cardiff and Bristol to Portsmouth
26 Cardiff to Portsmouth - summary
27 Bristol to Weymouth
28 Cardiff to Bristol and Bath
29 Bristol to Severn Beach
30 London to Taunton, Tiverton, Exeter & Plymouth
31 Bristol and Exeter to Plymouth
32 Exmouth to Exeter
33 Exeter St Davids to Exeter Central
34 Barnstaple to Exeter
35 Plymouth to Penzance
36 Plymouth to St Budeaux and Gunnislake
37 Liskeard to Looe
38 Par to Newquay
39 Truro to Falmouth
40 Penzance and St Erth to St Ives

An A5 sized timetable will be produced on a limited print, priced at ^2.50 run basis which contains all First Great Western routes under one cover
The A5 timetable will only be available via FirstInfo. Customers will need to telephone or apply online

If you go to:

http://ojp.nationalrail.co.uk/en/pj/pyot

you can make your own timetable. Seems to work OK.

Is this the future?

Hate that NR timetable ... you can't print a full day in one go.

Brilliant! Thanks for the info D_M

Agreed. I do wish NR would modify their print your own timetable to include an option to show a full day's trains. With XC print your own timetable you can print a whole day's trains, however it hasn't been well set up for page breaks with timetables often being broken up over two pages which is very fustrating and could easily be fixed with a simple program change.

http://www.crosscountrytrains.co.uk/Find_a_train/Create_your_own_timetable.aspx
This works for any timetable and not just XC services.

I'm still waiting for FGW to launch their own version of print your own timetable. They currently direct you to the NR site.

I personally prefer TOC timetable books, as they do not require me to spend time, ink and paper printing them! ;)

Have you tried SWT's - they have the 'whole day' option - can't comment on print quality though...

Paul

Must give SWT's a try, thanks Paul. I'm still a fan of the printed timetable though  :)

Just tried the SWT one.

http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/SWTrains/Timetablesearch/CreateYourTimetable.htm

Initial tests looked rather good ... however, a few things that I'm learning into with how it works / don't expect your first timetable to be exactly what you want, but I have already overcome most of the issues with my first test.

Printed versions of the May 2009 timetables were available from display at Truro this morning.

Disappointing they aren't online yet  :(

Have just tried it too and it does exactly the same thing as the XC PYOT splitting the timetable when it reaches the bottom of the page. Surely a simple page break command can be added to avoid this happening. If TOCs want people to use PYOT more then these are the sort of things that need to be fixed. Apart from that I'm very impressed with both the SWT and XC ones. Would be even more impressed with National Rail's PYOT if they did 24 hour TT and not just four hour time segments.

Just been updated this afternoon that the plan to charge has been dropped - apparently Passenger Focus complained. The TT books will be "rare" though, what I've heard.

It'll be annoying for places like Filton Abbey Wood, from what I can see they won't appear on one TT.

Since when were they going to charge? :o >:(

That's annoying as I am very happy to pay a small fee to have the complete book. Whats the problem with charging for it if the TOC provides free pocket timetables for those who don't want the complete TT or to pay? Haven't Passenger Focus got anything better to look into at the moment?

Agreed, I wouldn't have minded paying. And BTline, read the thread...

When SWT carried out a survey about their excellent A5 complete TT book, I ticked the box saying that I was happy to pay. They decided not to charge and send it to you FREE and postage paid. How long this will continue I don't know.

I see. Mojo's post was confusing.

Here you go everyone. New FGW timetables now online:
http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=3899

May I say how delighted I am that finally the Cardiff-Portsmouth timetable is now available on it's own having been split from the Birmingham-Exeter timetable that was previously timetable book E. Overall, FGW have done an excellent job with this new range of timetables.

Thanks for the heads up.

1st glaring error of the day: 0730 Paddington - Penzance doesn't have via Bristol on it :P

National Timetable also available on line
http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/4178.aspx

whoops!

It looks like my source for the Cotswold Line trains reverting back to HST's might well have been wrong, as all the current turbo operated ones remain lacking with the little 'H' symbol.

Also, as this timetable will be a bit of a write off on that route because of the re-doubling work anyway, I'm not surprised to see late evening services replaced by buses. However the last two departures from London will be buses from Oxford weekdays (except Friday) and if you wanted to go through to Worcester on them then you're faced with a bus journey of over 3 hours - that's getting on for 2 hours longer that it would take on the train.

Surely two buses should be provided, one to cater for Hanborough, Charlbury, Shipton, and Kingham, with the other running straight to Moreton and then on to Honeybourne, Evesham, Pershore and Worcester? I reckon between 40-50 minutes journey time could be saved for Moreton and beyond by doing it that way. Sending a bus on a 3-hour magical mystery tour of all the stations on a route which doesn't really follow any major roads for much of the time is preposterous, and hopefully common sense will see these provisional details changed for the better.

Are there going to be any booklets, with the MD's message and passenger info/facilities?

Just had a look at the new timetables - I get the distinct impression that someone in a FGW back office was told to split down the old booklet "E" into bite sized chunks. Unfortunately this person didn't have much of an understanding of:
a. FGW route structure
b. The basic geography of the West Country

I have recently used (and will again) the FGW direct service from Warminster to Worcester to get to Birmingham at half the price of the "direct" route.
I will not go into the question as to who decided to run a through (I won't call it direct !) rail service between Brighton and Great Malvern: anyway, it's there - and I use it for part of its route.

In booklet E, the whole journey of (say) the 0900 from Brighton to Great Malvern (a 1437) via Warminster (d 1133) is shown on one page (p83). Clear, concise and understandable: booklet E may not be the smallest book in the world, but it does only weigh 171 gms - hardly the Oxford English Dictionary or Enclyopedia Brittanica to lug around with you !

Just imagine, I don't know the area very well - so I go to the FGW website to find a through service from Warminster to Worcester.

25: Tells me that there is a train from Brighton at 0900, Warminster at 1133, but this seems to terminate at Bristol Parkway at 1252. Nowhere does it say that this train continues to Worcester - or anywhere. The notes do however, tell me that it stops at Hove, Havant, etc, etc, !
22: Tells me that there is a train from Parkway to Worcester at 1252 - that time rings a bell ! Wonder where that train comes from - according to this timetable it starts from Bath at 1208 ! No other info in the notes.
Let's have a look at:-
26: There is a train from Warminster at 1133, but that appears to be a service only operating between Southampton Central and Bristol Temple Meads !
23: Had a look at this, as I think the places mentioned in this timetable are on my route. However, this just appears to cover an incredibly busy shuttle service between Gloucester and Cheltenham by no less than FOUR different companies - what a goldmine this route must be !

I'm afraid the new timetables were a good idea - BUT !   I wonder what the posters that they will put up on the platforms will be like ?  Now where did I leave my RAC road atlas ?

But presumably these were in preparation for some time, especially with the wholesale revamp of the timetables, so your source may be more up to date.

Can't help thinking that this Cotswold Line timetable is a bit of a waste of time. Surely for this route it would have made more sense to either wait until the summer works arrangements were known as well, so those could appear within it, or split the period into three, with separate issues for May to mid-July, July-August and September-December.

You're entirely right about the buses and I can't see why they haven't tried to come to some arrangement with Stagecoach to see if they could cover the west Oxfordshire stations, either with a separate service, or some adjustment of their late-evening timetable for route S2 to Charlbury and Chipping Norton.

As for Worcester passengers, by picking my way through the various timetables, I have found that from September 7, there will be a 22.54 departure from Gloucester to Worcester, arriving 23.29, connecting out of the 20.45 from Paddington, which involves a change at Swindon as well. Not great, but better than that insane bus ride.

As mentioned about.... why do so many companies operate the Cheltenham - Glouceste rroute?  Is it really that much more profitable that they all want a chunk?

Why can't they just go back to how First Great Western, Thames Trains and Wales & West did their timetables?  That system worked very well.

Cheltenham has a population of 90,000, about three-quarters that of Gloucester, so of course they want a slice of the action - it also means passengers get a frequent service, and with XC bypassing Gloucester much of the day, passengers don't have to hang around between connections very long. The ATW trains that now run through from Cardiff just used to sit around for ages at Gloucester, so why not use the time productively?

I believe that FGW are publishing a 'Travelling with FGW' brochure that would cover all the extra items that used to appear in the five main TT books such as catering, train safety etc.

To help you find your new timetable, FGW have listed main stations with the stations they serve with the relevent timetable number: http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=3776

Please keep the comments coming in whether or not you like the new format.

To follow on from my previous post - used the link above, from Westbury, as Warminster isn't on the list. According to the timetables listed there, there is no service traveling North of Bristol Temple Meads !

Tried the print your own timetable, that at least did show the through trains, but the note on the bottom was a little disconcerting !

"The information printed here is only valid at date and time of printing"   - Doesn't inspire much confidence for the trip I am  planning for July.

I think they should go back to the old versions. (except Booklet E, which needed changing)

*You had a message from the MD, showing the highlights of the new timetable;

*You had details of catering, safety etc.

*You had station facilities listed

and so on.

Yes - have these "route cards" as well, but have the booklets allowing people to plan longer journeys.

Does anyone have any news on being able to obtain the full FGW timetable book, if indeed one now exists after Passenger Focus put their oar in and told FGW they can't charge for it?

I'm glad we are in agreement that Book E needed changing. Managed to pick up a copy of the new Cardiff-Portsmouth timetable the other day so much easier to read now its been split from other cross Bristol services though I do acknowledge your point moonrakerz about the loss of showing through services that continue northwards after Bristol that start from the South.

I've just downloaded the complete May 09 timetable and extracted Table 123 from it as a separate pdf document.  It doesn't give the full route of the North/South trains but where they appear in 123 they are at least properly labeled:
eg: 0900 from Brighton has a note saying "To Gt Malvern. Table 71"

Fine, no problem with that !

I've been informed that a "bumper" timetable is not to be produced.

Going to be a nightmare unless you commute by one of FGWs set timetables!

Wouldn't it just be easier if timetables were like how they used to be? (book B for example)

http://southwest-railways.50webs.com/fgw%20tt2.pdf

Yes - they obviously heard complaints about Booklet E, and have split all booklets up into small pieces!

E was the only problem book! The others were ideal.

Not indicating that a train goes further is disgraceful. It is as if they are discouraging passengers. A bad move by FGW... >:(

Thanks for the update D_M. I won't look silly by asking for something that doesn't exist now!

I went to my local FGW station the other day to buy an advance ticket (I usually buy online) and asked if they had any of the new summer timetables in yet. "Yes we do, they are out the back. Should be out in a week's time". Basically, couldn't be bothered to get them for me and before anyone says couldn't leave his desk because of a queue...there wasn't one.

That's rather bad, hate to say it but if he going to be like that he should have just said didn't have them yet.

Oh I've had that one as well knowing full well from posts that have taken place on this forum where members have picked up new timetables from places much further down the line in Devon and Cornwall so Bath are also bound to have stocks in especially when the FGW website say they are now available at stations. Sad to say that ever since Bath lost it's travel centre things have never been the same.

Having turned up at 8.30 on a Saturday morning only to be told I couldn't buy a ticket for advance travel until 9am despite three ticket booths manned and not one person in the queue. Not really service is it? Which makes me only want to buy tickets online which I can do 24/7 or maybe thats what TOCs want you to do. If thats the case they might as well replace all the staff with ticket machines. Whoops, I might have just spilt the beans on the TOCs future plans for selling tickets at stations  :o

Sorry - Ollie; that reads as if you're suggesting that ticket office staff should have lied to the customer (or at least been economic with the truth) - is that really what you intended to say?

Didn't mean it quite like that, just if it was me I'd rather be told they weren't available other than be told "yeah they are here but I can't be bothered to get out of this seat and get it"

Well SWT are now charging ^4 (+^1 P&P if ordered by phone) for their excellent complete TT book though I do wonder if ^4 is a little steep to begin with after offering it free of charge for so many years. Maybe they should have started pricing it at ^2. I'm sure other TOCs will be watching to see what take up is like for a complete TT book that is now chargeable.

I am still happy to pay ^4 for an excellent and useful SWT timetable and just wish FGW would do the same.

Hmm. Well, just to put this into perspective, from my other half's domestic expenditure point of view, the Radio Times these days is ^1.10 every bluddy week ...  ::)

http://www.bleb.org/tv/channel.html?ch=bbc1&all (http://www.bleb.org/tv/channel.html?ch=bbc1&all)

I know - that's exactly my bluddy point!  ::) :o :(