Train GraphicClick on the map to explore geographics
 
I need help
FAQ
Emergency
About .
No recent travel & transport from BBC stories as at 16:15 03 May 2025
Read about the forum [here].
Register [here] - it's free.
What do I gain from registering? [here]
 today - Walk to Pilning
10/05/25 - BRTA Westbury
10/05/25 - Model Railway Show, Calne
13/05/25 - Melksham TUG / AGM

On this day
3rd May (2018)
~ Just one working lower quadrant distant signal left (link)

Train RunningCancelled
15:10 Weston-Super-Mare to Severn Beach
17:01 Severn Beach to Bristol Temple Meads
18:04 Bristol Temple Meads to Bristol Parkway
18:48 Bristol Parkway to Bristol Temple Meads
22:15 Bristol Temple Meads to Westbury
Short Run
14:41 Cardiff Central to London Paddington
15:08 Didcot Parkway to London Paddington
15:09 Salisbury to Bristol Temple Meads
15:14 Hereford to London Paddington
15:23 Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central
15:30 Cardiff Central to Portsmouth Harbour
15:40 Gloucester to Worcester Foregate Street
16:38 London Paddington to Didcot Parkway
16:52 Worcester Foregate Street to Gloucester
Delayed
14:00 Cardiff Central to Penzance
15:23 Swansea to London Paddington
15:28 Carmarthen to London Paddington
16:07 Reading to Basingstoke
16:53 Basingstoke to Reading
17:37 Reading to Basingstoke
18:23 Basingstoke to Reading
19:05 Reading to Basingstoke
19:55 Basingstoke to Reading
20:37 Reading to Basingstoke
21:23 Basingstoke to Reading
22:05 Reading to Basingstoke
22:55 Basingstoke to Reading
Abbreviation pageAcronymns and abbreviations
Stn ComparatorStation Comparator
Rail newsNews Now - live rail news feed
Site Style 1 2 3 4
Next departures • Bristol Temple MeadsBath SpaChippenhamSwindonDidcot ParkwayReadingLondon PaddingtonMelksham
Exeter St DavidsTauntonWestburyTrowbridgeBristol ParkwayCardiff CentralOxfordCheltenham SpaBirmingham New Street
May 03, 2025, 16:30:06 *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Forgotten your username or password? - get a reminder
Most recently liked subjects
[160] Subtle train time changes
[156] Steam excursion - except there's much more diesel than steam!
[75] A very easy riddle
[72] In memory of the Weymouth Harbour Tramway on the anniversary o...
[49] Bath Spa station - dealing with future capacity issues - ideas...
[46] Service reduction - Coombe Junction
 
News: A forum for passengers ... with input from rail professionals welcomed too
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: [1]
  Print  
Author Topic: A franchise specification for growth?  (Read 4074 times)
ellendune
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 4524


View Profile
« on: February 19, 2012, 12:29:15 »

With a 15 year franchise and current growth levels how could a franchise specification deal with the overcrowding that would occur if the number of seats were fixed?

Chiltern trains have incraesed their fleet steadily through their franchise - what is in their franchise to make this happen?

Would it be reasonable to put in a condition requireing the winner to provide sufficient capacity at their own expense to meet the demands of sustained levels of overcrowding on any service?

If they have to go cap in hand to the DfT» (Department for Transport - about) every time they want more stock I can see not much happening. 

Once electrification starts to filter through, building additional electric stock would possibly be more viable and extending electrification might also release more deisel stock. However, is anyone going to buld new deisel stock anytime soon?

Logged
paul7575
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 5347


View Profile
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2012, 12:42:21 »

Chiltern trains have incraesed their fleet steadily through their franchise - what is in their franchise to make this happen?

Chiltern's existing franchise spec does have an explicit requirement to increase stock to deal with overcrowding - AIUI ('as I understand it') that is one of the key differences between Chiltern and every other existing franchise spec, partly to do with them being the only long franchise ever let by the SRA» (Strategic Rail Authority - about) before its abolition...

Section 6 page 12, specifically 6.1(a) seems to cover it:

Quote
The Franchise Operator shall use all reasonable endeavours to ensure that sufficient capacity is provided, on each train used in the provision of any Passenger Services, to carry, without excessive overcrowding, all passengers intending to travel on such train and holding a valid Fare (and, if required, a reservation) for such train.

http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/rail-passenger-franchise-agreement-chiltern-railways/chiltern-franchise-agreement-2012.pdf

Paul
« Last Edit: February 19, 2012, 20:21:03 by paul7755 » Logged
paul7575
Transport Scholar
Hero Member
******
Posts: 5347


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2012, 11:06:01 »

Once electrification starts to filter through, building additional electric stock would possibly be more viable and extending electrification might also release more deisel stock. However, is anyone going to buld new deisel stock anytime soon?

Commentators such as Roger Ford of Modern Railways repeatedly suggest that no new DMUs (Diesel Multiple Unit) are likely to be built for the foreseeable future.

There are many permutations of DMU cascades available following various electrification projects, the recent 'trans-pennine north route' ought to release a fair number of 185s (or 170s) for instance.  Then there are a number of electrification plans within Scotland, which ought to release 158s or 170s.  Also, Thameslink and Crossrail inject massive numbers of EMUs (Electric Multiple Unit) into the total mix, and many EMUs will become available from areas currently electrified for use elsewhere - this may require further electrification to soak up relatively modern EMUs that are additional to the well publicised 319s expected to come to the GW» (Great Western - used as an abbreviation for the area / lines under the Great Western franchise, as opposed to FGW which includes "First", the company operating them too. For tickets - about).   At some stage infill third rail projects should become viable, in the case of SN this could release a reasonable fleet of Turbostars (171s).

I think what can be sensibily predicted is that all the existing 'better quality' DMUs with a reasonable life expectancy, such as Turbos and Turbostars, will migrate elsewhere, and indirectly release Pacers while maintaining the steady state numbers, the real difficulty is how you improve capacity as well...

Paul   
Logged
Do you have something you would like to add to this thread, or would you like to raise a new question at the Coffee Shop? Please [register] (it is free) if you have not done so before, or login (at the top of this page) if you already have an account - we would love to read what you have to say!

You can find out more about how this forum works [here] - that will link you to a copy of the forum agreement that you can read before you join, and tell you very much more about how we operate. We are an independent forum, provided and run by customers of Great Western Railway, for customers of Great Western Railway and we welcome railway professionals as members too, in either a personal or official capacity. Views expressed in posts are not necessarily the views of the operators of the forum.

As well as posting messages onto existing threads, and starting new subjects, members can communicate with each other through personal messages if they wish. And once members have made a certain number of posts, they will automatically be admitted to the "frequent posters club", where subjects not-for-public-domain are discussed; anything from the occasional rant to meetups we may be having ...

 
Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.2 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
This forum is provided by customers of Great Western Railway (formerly First Great Western), and the views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that the content provided by one of our posters contravenes our posting rules via admin@railcustomer.info. Full legal statement (here).

Jump to top of pageJump to Forum Home Page