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Witham Bobby
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« Reply #15 on: May 12, 2026, 14:20:09 » |
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Some thoughts on what might be desirable outcomes:
Rolling stock that is compatible with other rolling stock in terms of couplings and inter-operability
Enough rolling stock to provide services that don't become crammed with passengers
An amount of spare capacity so that "more trains needing repairs than normal" does not result in cancellations
Traincrews that can work different types of rolling stock/multiple units/locos rather than having limited and specialised capabilities
Trains running on different routes that provide proper connections at stations where they meet
Improved attention to important basics like lineside vegetation and waterways/drains clearance
Reduction in cash spent on consultants to tell railway managers stuff they should already know
Enough spare traction at strategic locations so that failed trains are not stranded for hours on end waiting rescue
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #16 on: May 12, 2026, 20:10:54 » |
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A culture of Customer service like this.........?
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ChrisB
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« Reply #17 on: May 12, 2026, 20:54:14 » |
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From the BBC» What GWR▸ nationalisation means for passengers
Following the announcement that rail operator Great Western Railway (GWR) is to be brought under public ownership in December, train passengers may be wondering if the move will make any difference to things like ticket fares, jobs and timetables.
The Swindon-based operator, which is owned by FirstGroup, has run services and linked London to the south-west of England and Wales since 1996.
Several rail firms around the country are already publicly owned, including Great Anglia and South Western Railway. Welsh services were nationalised in 2021 and Scotland took trains into public ownership the following year.
The government plans to nationalise nearly all rail services in England by 2027.
When will GWR be nationalised?
The government confirmed that GWR will be nationalised on 13 December.
A spokesperson for the rail operator said they welcomed the clarity provided by the announcement and would continue to work closely with the Department for Transport (DfT» ).
Helen Godwin, mayor for the West of England Combined Authority, also welcomed the news.
"We deserve four trains an hour at stations across our growing regional rail network," she said.
"We will continue working with partners to deliver the infrastructure needed to make that ambition a reality."
What is nationalisation?
Nationalisation means bringing something under the control and ownership of the state or government.
The UK▸ 's rail system was fully nationalised shortly after World War Two, with the government owning all the networks and trains.
However, the industry was privatised in the 1990s and companies took over the operation of trains.
The rail infrastructure is managed by publicly-owned Network Rail while passenger train services are run by individual operators which are both privately and publicly owned.
The nationalisation process forms part of the Rail Public Ownership Bill which was the first major piece of legislation passed by the Labour government when it came into power in 2024.
The bill allows ministers to take operators back into public control as their contracts expire. Most of the freight operators will remain in private hands.
South Western Railway was the first company to be nationalised as its franchise ended in May 2025.
What is Great British Railways?
Eventually, all the train operators are likely to become part of a new organisation called Great British Railways (GBR▸ ).
The planned state-owned company will operate most of the country's rail infrastructure and the majority of passenger rail services as well as devolved and open-access operators.
For now, the train companies we are all familiar with will remain in stations around the country.
Will train fares go down?
No - but they will not go up this year.
Last year, the government announced a freeze on fares in England until March 2027.
The cap applies to regulated fares and includes season tickets and off-peak returns.
The government estimated that the move would save commuters on more expensive routes more than £300.
Transport Secretary Heidi Alexander previously said the focus of renationalising the country's rail network would be on improving services and infrastructure, rather than lowering ticket prices.
Will ticket buying methods change?
Unlike GWR, Transport for Wales (TfW▸ ), Cross Country and South Wales Metro network offers the option of pay as you go to passengers travelling between stations in South Wales. This facility is available in the West of England.
The payment method means passengers do not need tickets and they pay the best-value fare as prices are capped at a daily and weekly level to provide the best value.
Passengers travelling through the Severn Tunnel do not benefit from the scheme.
It is not yet known if the companies that are yet to be nationalised in England will offer the payment method.
What will happen to GWR staff?
In 2024, the government said it expected existing contractual terms and conditions for staff working at privately-owned operators like GWR to remain in place as ownership transfers , externalinto the public domain.
Transport union RMT▸ welcomed the establishment of GBR as a "once in a generation opportunity" but said it would seek discussions with the government to ensure the working conditions of the entire railway workforce were "protected and improved" with the new operator.
Is rail nationalisation good or bad?
The government said that ending payments to private sector operators would save £150m a year.
According to statistics, the government spent £21.6bn on railways in 2024-25, external, which was a 6.5% decrease compared to the previous year.
Although the government expects to save money through the nationalisation process, there is a risk for them if something goes wrong on the railways as there will be nobody else to blame.
It also hopes to establish an independent watchdog - the Passenger Standards Authority - to "champion improvement in service against a range of measures".
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Electric train
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« Reply #18 on: May 13, 2026, 07:47:16 » |
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A bit of a reality check ..........
Nothing will change overnight.
The NR» Route and GWR▸ TOC▸ executive boards in consultation with DfT» will have been working on the shape of the structure of the GW» .
The benefits may not be seen as a "wow" impact day one or even week one, however a lookback a year on should reveal improvements in performance.
Future rolling stock, IET▸ 's are with the Route for at least a decade or 2, 387 will be in the TV▸ for many years. Replacement for the Diesel fleets my guess early 2030's
The current legislation limits what can be done, ie the forming of GBR▸ and the bringing into public ownership the franchised TOC's; it be interesting to see what is in todays Kings speech relating to the railways, could we see the reshaping of the NR Routes and former TOC areas? The handing over the London Metro services to TfL» and similar the other Mayoral areas in England?
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"The real source of danger, and the only one which there is any hope of removing, is in a complication of imperfections in a great number of the mechanical parts of the system"
Isambard Kingdom Brunel
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stuving
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« Reply #19 on: May 13, 2026, 11:06:10 » |
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One thing you might ponder is this.
Currently the budgets for infrastructure (NR» ) and operations (TOCs▸ , however owned) are both fixed by DfT» but are quite separate. The transfers between them (access charges and delay "compensation") are known before these budgets are fixed. So when NR runs out of money (not infrequent) it does not impact the finances of the operations side.
The plan is to merge the infrastructure and operations branches into a single organisation, and for this to make any sense at all in management terms it must imply a common budget. So now, when a big infrastructure project overruns in time and money, where does the extra money needed get taken from?
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John D
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« Reply #20 on: May 13, 2026, 12:37:09 » |
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The benefits may not be seen as a "wow" impact day one or even week one, however a lookback a year on should reveal improvements in performance.
Why do you think performance will improve, GWR▸ haven't managed it for months, and if got same equipment (but it will be bit older, and possibly more worn out, and same staff on the ground doing same as they do today. So what makes you think they can do better. https://www.gwr.com/-/media/gwr-sc-website/files/publications/performance-report/gwr-performance-report-period-2613.pdfMost recent period failed to run 2.59% of trains, Of those that ran, only 65.56% were on time, and 2.39% were over 15 minutes late 350 were shortformed below DfT» minimum (12.5 trains per day) ..... more likely to be, welcome to your nationalised railway where third of trains are late, some don't run, and reasonable chance will be less carriages than ideal. |
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« Reply #21 on: May 13, 2026, 13:00:46 » |
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One thing you might ponder is this.
Currently the budgets for infrastructure (NR» ) and operations (TOCs▸ , however owned) are both fixed by DfT» but are quite separate. The transfers between them (access charges and delay "compensation") are known before these budgets are fixed. So when NR runs out of money (not infrequent) it does not impact the finances of the operations side.
The plan is to merge the infrastructure and operations branches into a single organisation, and for this to make any sense at all in management terms it must imply a common budget. So now, when a big infrastructure project overruns in time and money, where does the extra money needed get taken from?
Railway Control Period 7 (aka CP7▸ ) 1 April 2024 – 31 March 2029 is the last one, a new system of Railway funding is being put in place this I have been informed will combine infrastructure and rolling stock renewals / enhancements into a single determination. As the TOC's and NR Routes commence the merge into single business units the budget is in effect a single budget, there are ORR» and DfT governance rules in place because GBR▸ is still not a full legal entity; there already a number of TOC's and NR routes (the first in July 2025 was Southeastern Trains and NR Kent Route merged to form South Eastern Railway) I know the senior railway management are very mindful not to crash head long (literally) into change. A workshop I attended before I retired focused very much about getting the management structural change done safely. Many of the now senior managers were young junior staff / manages at privatisation and witnessed the hastily changed structure of the railway management, they do not want to see the likes of Hatfield, Southall, Ladbroke Grove, Potters Barr as a result of their leadership decisions. Whether the Government / DfT can be kept away from applying pressure on the industry to change quickly for political reasons is yet to be seen |
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"The real source of danger, and the only one which there is any hope of removing, is in a complication of imperfections in a great number of the mechanical parts of the system"
Isambard Kingdom Brunel
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« Reply #22 on: May 13, 2026, 13:05:56 » |
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The benefits may not be seen as a "wow" impact day one or even week one, however a lookback a year on should reveal improvements in performance.
Why do you think performance will improve, GWR▸ haven't managed it for months, and if got same equipment (but it will be bit older, and possibly more worn out, and same staff on the ground doing same as they do today. So what makes you think they can do better. https://www.gwr.com/-/media/gwr-sc-website/files/publications/performance-report/gwr-performance-report-period-2613.pdfMost recent period failed to run 2.59% of trains, Of those that ran, only 65.56% were on time, and 2.39% were over 15 minutes late 350 were shortformed below DfT» minimum (12.5 trains per day) ..... more likely to be, welcome to your nationalised railway where third of trains are late, some don't run, and reasonable chance will be less carriages than ideal. The combining of GWR TOC▸ and GW» Route will improve performance and time keeping as I said lets take a look in a years time; however the challenge maybe the reliability of the class 800's and the aging diesel fleet |
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"The real source of danger, and the only one which there is any hope of removing, is in a complication of imperfections in a great number of the mechanical parts of the system"
Isambard Kingdom Brunel
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broadgage
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« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2026, 19:10:32 » |
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Several posts refer to the problems with IET▸ reliability, is this now admitted to be a problem ? I thought that the official view was they are fine, and so much better than the HSTs▸ . A significant number of forum members seem to back the official view.
I thought it was only me, and a few others who held differing views.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU▸ is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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grahame
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« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2026, 05:21:11 » |
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Several posts refer to the problems with IET▸ reliability, is this now admitted to be a problem ? I thought that the official view was they are fine, and so much better than the HSTs▸ . A significant number of forum members seem to back the official view.
I thought it was only me, and a few others who held differing views.
I would suspect (no facts to hand - so a guess) that they're as reliable as the other trains if not better, but that does not make them perfect with near-100% availability. And I have a suspicion that specifications and targets are set which work with optimistic availability without very many spares. That's fine whilst you accept that you'll get the occasional lack of stock / short form / cancellation, but that very much depends on what you're (as operator / specifier in future too) willing to accept. I am in Western mainland Europe as write this, and I am struck by the train yards with substantial numbers of multiple units sitting there. And I contrast that with passing Reading which at times seems like an array of empty sidings with everything in use. Again, no figures. And yesterday I was on a train with one of the doors along the unit marked as "this door out of action" and we had to use the one just through to get on/off on the left hand side. Not seen as an issue here, but perhaps in the UK▸ it would have resulted in a carriage out of use, or even a whole train out, and with no spare? Much more to write up in due course, or perhaps to confine to memory banks. But the system here is not perfect either. Yesterday from Helsingborg to Osnabroeuk showed a number of just the same issues as we have in the UK, and much of the great way that the railway actually works too. Back on topic - nationalised GWR▸ and what to expect. I will be following up your ideas in addition to mine (many similar / overlapping - but some of yours are more technical). I do especially like the "let's have everything coupleable to everything else" ... and I find myself wondering if that allows us to have a common pool such that when there are planned engineering works, or special events, rolling stock is not limited to the TOC▸ / area of normal use but can be moved around - congestion-buster trains that cover Glastonbury one weekend, the Great North run the next, and the Celitic v Rangers match the one after. I am aware that intercoupleing to some extent may set a standard in stone and be a limiter to improved technology ... |
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Coffee Shop Admin, Chair of Melksham Transport User Group, West Wiltshire Rail User Group Committee and TravelWatch SouthWest Board Member
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Electric train
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« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2026, 15:53:08 » |
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Several posts refer to the problems with IET▸ reliability, is this now admitted to be a problem ? I thought that the official view was they are fine, and so much better than the HSTs▸ . A significant number of forum members seem to back the official view.
I thought it was only me, and a few others who held differing views.
My comment about the reliability of the class 800 is they are not maintained by the new combined infrastructure / train operator organisation but is reliant on a contract with a supplier. HST were in their early days had a horrendously bad failure rate, it was just the fact that BR▸ had an over supply of traction and rolling stock it did not show up as bad; the TOC▸ 's knew how to deal with HST problems through their life; but as the HST's aged they were becoming very expensive to keep in service |
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"The real source of danger, and the only one which there is any hope of removing, is in a complication of imperfections in a great number of the mechanical parts of the system"
Isambard Kingdom Brunel
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