New Oxford - Bristol direct service, ongoing developments and discussion

[whole diary]

[Mark A]

I'm wondering how the Coffeeshop forum's disruption map will render this service. (Obviously, also hoping it will not need to render it at all.)

Mark

[Mark A]

Can they be persuaded to continue the service on to Milton Keynes? I understand that there is an unmet need for such a service and a nice newly rebuilt line available...

*Snorts*: introducing the new East of the city park and ride for Bath: Oxford Parkway. :-)

Mark

[grahame]

I'm wondering how the Coffeeshop forum's disruption map will render this service. (Obviously, also hoping it will not need to render it at all.)

Mark

It's been doing distruptions to the two Saturday trains AOK - it should show fine.

I did note that the King's Speech includes a rationalisation of 14 websites into one and there is no guarantee our feed will remain - so there may be changes needed at the Coffee Shop.

[JohnM]

Indeed, all good for a launch on Monday as originally hoped.  Services now in RealTimeTrains and the journey planners:

Brilliant! For my Melksham-Bristol commute:

• it's now practical to catch the 07:21 from Melksham instead of the 06:29 (because if I miss the unofficial 07:33 connection at Chippenham (likely) there's the new 07:47, don't have to wait for the 08:09)
  
• what was going to be a >30 min wait at Chippenham (due to the 18:00 CPM^▸ (Chippenham station)-MKM^▸ (Melksham station) moving to 18:09) is reduced to ~20 mins thanks to the new 17:15 from Bristol, which I'll catch instead of the 17:00.
  

[grahame]

Indeed, all good for a launch on Monday as originally hoped.  Services now in RealTimeTrains and the journey planners:

Brilliant! For my Melksham-Bristol commute:

• it's now practical to catch the 07:21 from Melksham instead of the 06:29 (because if I miss the unofficial 07:33 connection at Chippenham (likely) there's the new 07:47, don't have to wait for the 08:09)
  
• what was going to be a >30 min wait at Chippenham (due to the 18:00 CPM^▸ (Chippenham station)-MKM^▸ (Melksham station) moving to 18:09) is reduced to ~20 mins thanks to the new 17:15 from Bristol, which I'll catch instead of the 17:00.
  

Yes - those are *very* pleasing ... and it is also pleasing to see practical commutes from Westbury, Trowbridge, Melkshan (and Chippenham and Swindon) to Oxford too.

[IndustryInsider]

Indeed, all good for a launch on Monday as originally hoped.  Services now in RealTimeTrains and the journey planners:

Brilliant! For my Melksham-Bristol commute:

• it's now practical to catch the 07:21 from Melksham instead of the 06:29 (because if I miss the unofficial 07:33 connection at Chippenham (likely) there's the new 07:47, don't have to wait for the 08:09)
  
• what was going to be a >30 min wait at Chippenham (due to the 18:00 CPM^▸ (Chippenham station)-MKM^▸ (Melksham station) moving to 18:09) is reduced to ~20 mins thanks to the new 17:15 from Bristol, which I'll catch instead of the 17:00.
  

Yes - those are *very* pleasing ... and it is also pleasing to see practical commutes from Westbury, Trowbridge, Melkshan (and Chippenham and Swindon) to Oxford too.

A good example of a service planned and implemented for a different market also having positive benefits elsewhere.

Can they be persuaded to continue the service on to Milton Keynes? I understand that there is an unmet need for such a service and a nice newly rebuilt line available...

There have been whispers of exactly that happening!  Can’t see it myself, not for a few years at least, but you never know.

[Oxonhutch]

There have been whispers of exactly that happening!  Can’t see it myself, not for a few years at least, but you never know.

Well, the stock do have train managers aboard.

[JohnM]

Indeed, all good for a launch on Monday as originally hoped.  Services now in RealTimeTrains and the journey planners:

Brilliant! For my Melksham-Bristol commute:

• it's now practical to catch the 07:21 from Melksham instead of the 06:29 (because if I miss the unofficial 07:33 connection at Chippenham (likely) there's the new 07:47, don't have to wait for the 08:09)
  
• what was going to be a >30 min wait at Chippenham (due to the 18:00 CPM^▸ (Chippenham station)-MKM^▸ (Melksham station) moving to 18:09) is reduced to ~20 mins thanks to the new 17:15 from Bristol, which I'll catch instead of the 17:00.
  

Yes - those are *very* pleasing ... and it is also pleasing to see practical commutes from Westbury, Trowbridge, Melkshan (and Chippenham and Swindon) to Oxford too.

A good example of a service planned and implemented for a different market also having positive benefits elsewhere.

...although it will be interesting to see how busy those services are; the Chippenham-Bristol IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train - replacement for HSTs (manufactured by Hitachi in Kobe, Japan)) are fine if you move down to coach C and beyond, certainly a much better chance of getting 2 seats to yourself (and working on laptop) than on the 2 coach service I'm currently catching at Trowbridge.

Speaking of which, the 06:29 Trowbridge and 07:21 Chippenham commutes are both scheduled as taking 59 mins. But the latter should occasionally drop to 44 mins when the 07:21 is on time, allowing connection with the (existing) 07:33 Bristol service instead of the (new) 07:47.

EDIT: that is, I think someone said the new services wouldn't be IETs? Might have got that wrong.

[Mark A]

Presumably they're IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train - replacement for HSTs (manufactured by Hitachi in Kobe, Japan)) as the National Rail site lists 1st class fares against them.

For Bath to Oxford:

Anytime standard day return £77.20
Anytime standard return £169.40
Anytime 1st return £202.20
Anytime 1st return £278.60 (allows travel via Reading but not via London terminals - for comparison, a Bath Spa to London Paddington anytime return is £380.60.)

Mark

[ChrisB]

There have been whispers of exactly that happening!  Can’t see it myself, not for a few years at least, but you never know.

Well, the stock do have train managers aboard.

Lack of stock for those journeys I reckon

Presumably they're IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train - replacement for HSTs (manufactured by Hitachi in Kobe, Japan)) as the National Rail site lists 1st class fares against them.

For Bath to Oxford:

Anytime standard day return £77.20

Strewth. Not even an hour.

[grahame]

Pathed as IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train - replacement for HSTs (manufactured by Hitachi in Kobe, Japan)) - thought I did note one Saturday case in recent months of a turbo being run instead. 



All times shown are public timetable departures (obviously arrivals at final station)
No Sunday service

[TaplowGreen]

There have been whispers of exactly that happening!  Can’t see it myself, not for a few years at least, but you never know.

Well, the stock do have train managers aboard.

Lack of stock for those journeys I reckon

Presumably they're IETs^▸ (Intercity Express Train - replacement for HSTs (manufactured by Hitachi in Kobe, Japan)) as the National Rail site lists 1st class fares against them.

For Bath to Oxford:

Anytime standard day return £77.20

Strewth. Not even an hour.

That's a considerable increase from the current Bath - Oxford fare isn't it?

[Chris from Nailsea]

From the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page):

Direct Oxford to Swindon rail service set to begin after 23 years

A direct rail service from Oxford to Swindon is expected to set off for the first time in more than 20 years.

The first daily direct service will begin on Monday from 07:00 BST, travelling from Oxford to Bristol Temple Meads, after Network Rail and Great Western Railway (GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway)) gave the final sign-off on Friday. The new service, which comes back into operation after 23 years, cuts more than 10 minutes off the current fastest weekday journey time to under 30 minutes.

Marcus Jones, Network Rail western route director, said the service would "open up new opportunities for work, education and leisure".

Currently, there are no direct services between Swindon and Oxford, according to the Local Democracy Reporting Service. Passengers have to change at Didcot Parkway or Reading to travel between the two stations.

It comes after the Office of Rail and Road (ORR^» (Office of Rail and Road, formerly Office of Rail Regulation - about)) approved a bid on 13 May from GWR to run a two-hourly service between Bristol, Swindon and Oxford on weekdays and Saturdays from 17 May.

The new service will run Monday to Saturday, between Bristol Temple Meads, Bath Spa, Chippenham, Swindon and Oxford. The first service leaves Oxford at 07:00 on Monday, arriving into Swindon at 07:30 and Bristol Temple Meads at 08:20. From Bristol, the first train will leave at 07:14, arriving into Swindon at 07:59 and Oxford at 08:32. Fastest direct journey times from Oxford will be one hour and eight minutes, and from Bristol one hour and 11 minutes.

Jones said: "These links will make it easier for people to travel between key economic centres, opening up new opportunities for work, education and leisure, while we continue to deliver further improvements across the route in the months ahead."

Transport Secretary and Swindon South MP^▸ (Member of Parliament, or Mile Post (a method of measuring the railway in miles and chains from a starting point - usually London), depending on context) Heidi Alexander said the service would "provide a fast, convenient alternative to being stuck in a traffic jam on the A420".

Mark Hopwood, GWR managing director, said: "We are confident that these new services demonstrate the value of rail in driving economic growth, environmental benefits, and creating education and employment opportunities."

[Mark A]

Bath to Oxford return trip via rail is around 126 miles, so... for the anytime day return, is that ~60 pence per mile? (Or around £1.60 per mile for 1st class return).

Mischievously, we can work out the income from a round trip at peak times with a hypothetical 100% occupancy of the seating by full fare paying adults (not, of course, a calculation that reflects reality). £7272 from First and £22330 from standard, so, the total fare take would be £29.602.

Returning to the real world, yes, if it wasn't for that anytime day return at ~£77, it's actually pricier than Bath Spa to Birmingham which by rail, with its slightly round-the-houses route, is around a 200 mile return trip (and priced for good measure by Crosscountry).

While most people will presumably not be travelling on walk-up tickets it's worth bearing them in mind because if someone *has* to make a short-horizon decision to travel (think 'Family emergency') - does not have their own wheels - and has to use peak time trains, these are the prices to which they'll be exposed.

Mark

[brooklea]

Are the fares any different to now? (Spoiler alert - I don’t think they are).

Those making a day trip, and not travelling out on the first direct train of the day, will presumably pay the (walk-up) Off-Peak Day Return fare of £26.70, which doesn’t seem excessive to me.