When is a window seat not a window seat?

[whole diary]

[grahame]

When I book a cruise, I have a choice of cabin type.  And two types are "sea view" and "restricted sea view" which means you'll be peering around a lifeboat or other obstruction.  And if I choose the "restricted" room, I'll be saving some money because of the grotty loss of view.

When I booked a seat on LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about) from Inverness to Kings Cross, I selected a window seat. But - look - when I got there, the graphic above the seat shows a window, but instead of a window there's a bulkhead.  And, no, the seat didn't come at a reduced price.  Do we still have a "trade descriptions act"? Why can't the rail providers do it like the water/floating providers?



There were a number of better (real transparent windowed) seats around all marked "may be reserved later", but when I asked the train manager if he could switch me to one of those, he denied my request. Again comparing, if we have a cabin problem on a cruise, we go to reception who sort us out; we have never had to switch a cabin so I can't tell personal experience, but I've heard of switches happening and only being denied when the ship is full.

If seats "may be reserved later", why the **** couldn't the Train Manager reserve one for me that met the description of what I had booked?   I was in coach J - he did tell me that coach C was unreserved, and if I wished I could move back there and try my luck.  He couldn't (or didn't or wouldn't) tell me what my chances were.



Not really getting at the Train Manager who was just, no doubt, doing what he's been trained to do.  But what a customer-unfriendly system.  Could it be done better?  Yes - take an example from Carnival who are in the business of selling journeys that the customers want to enjoy and buy again.  From Inverness to London - perhaps I would have got a better view if I had flown.

A little thing but the little things add up.

[Timmer]

LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about)’s equivalent of Ryanair’s infamous seat 11A:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-14421981/Ryanair-11a-seat-worst-airline.html

[bobm]

Interestingly this is something which has occupied my mind over the last few days.  I have been trying to reserve a pair of seats on a peak hour service to London Paddington.

Three times it has offered me seats at the very end of various carriages which have no view and once seats 13 and 14 which have the bulkhead as Graham encountered.   

[grahame]

Interestingly this is something which has occupied my mind over the last few days.  I have been trying to reserve a pair of seats on a peak hour service to London Paddington.

Three times it has offered me seats at the very end of various carriages which have no view and once seats 13 and 14 which have the bulkhead as Graham encountered.   

I hate to suggest a conspiracy theory - but could it be that the systems allocate reservations in unpopular seats - perhaps with the logic that people who turn up for these seats are more likely to be people who will just accept what they are given?   I also wondered if I had been allocated a seat which I suspect is universally regarded as awful because my journey was so long - best upset one person / Inverness to London than 3 people - Inverness to Perth, Stirling to Newcastle and Newcastle to London?

[PhilWakely]

LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about)’s equivalent of Ryanair’s infamous seat 11A:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-14421981/Ryanair-11a-seat-worst-airline.html

Many moons ago - October 1999 to be precise - my wife and I flew from Exeter to Toronto on a direct Air Transat flight. We were offered the option of choosing our seats at £7 a time (i.e £28 for the whole return flight). No plan of the aircraft (a 737 IIRC^▸ ('if I recall/remember/read correctly')) was available, so we chose a Window and middle seat roughly in the middle of the aircraft. Imagine our surprise when boarding to find the only window seat 'without a window' and no chance of moving. So, what turned out to be an 'interesting 13 hour (instead of 7 hour)' flight was none too pleasant!


Returning to the present, I've noticed that, when booking Cross Country seats, the descriptions 'Window view' and 'Window no view' frequently crop up. Presumably to cater for the seat adjacent to a bulkhead situation

[brooklea]

  Could it be done better? 

Of course…. by the simple(?) expedient of providing the information on which seats have restricted views on the page of the booking site where you select your seat, rather than requiring you to open a second browser window to view the seating layout pdf (https://www.lner.co.uk/globalassets/_page-structure/azuma-content/azuma-seat-maps-aug2021-min.pdf), which you then have to cross reference to the booking page to ensure you don’t get a ‘no-window’ window seat.

Easy enough when you’re aware, but would be easier if you didn’t have to because the information is all on one page…

[grahame]

Easy enough when you’re aware, but would be easier if you didn’t have to because the information is all on one page…

Gee ... I suppose so ... but I / we shouldn't have to.   

A window is

an opening in the wall or roof of a building or vehicle, fitted with glass in a frame to admit light or air and allow people to see out

... a number of similar definitions online.   So the ticket sale sight was wrong to give me seat 78 when I requested a window seat, and without saying "we cannot allocate exactly what you are looking for" as I have seen done at times. 

[brooklea]

Easy enough when you’re aware, but would be easier if you didn’t have to because the information is all on one page…

Gee ... I suppose so ... but I / we shouldn't have to.   

I completely agree.

[brooklea]

I recently travelled with LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about) - no seat reservation as the ticket was purchased at the booking office about ten minutes before departure. Luckily it wasn’t too busy, so I took a seat (with a window, although it wasn’t long before sunset), which happened to be one marked with the orange light - “May be reserved later”. Not wishing to have to move, I decided to have a go at reserving ‘my’ seat, and after registering with the LNER website, I soon had a reservation from the next booked station call to Kings Cross (in another carriage), which I was then able to change for the seat I was sat in. It passed a few minutes, but the progress was pretty straightforward.

Incidentally, the display didn’t change to show that the seat was reserved after the next station call, so whilst the back room reservation system knew the seat was taken, the train’s systems remained unaware!

[eightonedee]

Quote from: grahame on Today at 05:31:18
  Could it be done better?

Of course…. by the simple(?) expedient of providing the information on which seats have restricted views on the page of the booking site where you select your seat, rather than requiring you to open a second browser window to view the seating layout pdf (https://www.lner.co.uk/globalassets/_page-structure/azuma-content/azuma-seat-maps-aug2021-min.pdf), which you then have to cross reference to the booking page to ensure you don’t get a ‘no-window’ window seat.

Easy enough when you’re aware, but would be easier if you didn’t have to because the information is all on one page…

Better still, build trains with fenestration that lines up with windows....please.

[ChrisB]

LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about) have a seat chooser in their booking system, so you can pick your seat. And they show you where the windows are too. Book with LNER direct.

Some other TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) (avanti?) have the same option.

[Clan Line]

LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about)’s equivalent of Ryanair’s infamous seat 11A:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-14421981/Ryanair-11a-seat-worst-airline.html

............. No plan of the aircraft (a 737 IIRC^▸ ('if I recall/remember/read correctly')) was available, so we chose a Window and middle seat roughly in the middle of the aircraft. Imagine our surprise when boarding to find the only window seat 'without a window' and no chance of moving. .....................

Many years ago when I was "shuttling" between Heathrow & Edinburgh - on the very nice BA^» (British Airways - about) 757s, I soon discovered that row 13 had, not only no window, but appeared to have air conditioning plumbing behind the panelling, as it could get quite warm to the touch. Not a nice seat -  only sat there once !

If you are flying again soon, I can recommend this website: https://www.aerolopa.com  (LOPA stands for Layout Of Passenger Aircraft - not some dodgy Central American airline !). I have used it several times and it has been spot on.

[LiskeardRich]

LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about)’s equivalent of Ryanair’s infamous seat 11A:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-14421981/Ryanair-11a-seat-worst-airline.html

Is it just Ryanair, or everyone’s version of that plane?

[Timmer]

If you are flying again soon, I can recommend this website: https://www.aerolopa.com  (LOPA stands for Layout Of Passenger Aircraft - not some dodgy Central American airline !). I have used it several times and it has been spot on.

My go to website for aircraft layouts. As you say, spot on. Found out about it from aviation YouTuber Noel Philips.

[UstiImmigrunt]

LNER^» (London North Eastern Railway - about)’s equivalent of Ryanair’s infamous seat 11A:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-14421981/Ryanair-11a-seat-worst-airline.html

Is it just Ryanair, or everyone’s version of that plane?

Different airlines have different seating plans. Ryanair want the maximum number of seats so don't care about window views. An airline could easily have a window for everyone and good leg room.