Level crossing waiting times

[whole diary]

[froome]

I have had to wait a fair while at several level crossings over the years, but taking a trip to London this weekend with my folding bike I found one that beat them all. I took a train to Mortlake and then had to cycle south, crossing the level crossing, and later had to return that way (though not to catch the train). Sadly I didn't actually time my waits, but I'm sure the wait from exiting the station was well in excess of ten minutes, and 5 trains crossed during that period. When I returned a few hours later. as I cycled along Mortlake High Street there was a long queue of vehicles waiting, and I thought to myself "That's good, I won't have to wait that long this time." How wrong I was. The wait was at least as long as the wait in the morning, and several of the people waiting around me were getting extremely frustrated judging by their calls on their phones they were having. There seemed to be a gap of well over 5 minutes (it felt like about ten) when no train passed by, and people just couldn't understand why the crossing didn't open.

Yes this crossing, and others I have had to wait at for several minutes, had footbridges alongside, but they are always very steeply graded steps, of no use at all to those with mobility issues or heavy luggage or cannot manage their bike and luggage up steps that steep. On the return journey, I noticed that several pedestrians and some cyclists, who had been waiting longer than me, eventually gave up waiting and tried the footbridge route, not all with success.

So I wondered which crossings people have found themselves having to wait for the longest times. Before this experience, my longest have been when visiting Lincoln, and using the crossing immediately west of the station. I also travel to Shoreham-by-Sea a lot and that can involve long waits at the crossing next to the station, though on average it isn't usually too bad.

[stuving]

When was this? The communications failure at around midday affected not just GSM-R^▸ (Global System for Mobile communications - Railway. A simple mobile phone that has been fitted to the turbos to allow them to operate on lines that are not covered by the cab secure radio (CSR). This allows the Network Rail control centre to send simple STOP messages to the driver or the driver to contact the controller in emergency only. When this system is in operation a guard must be provided when in passenger operation.), but phones and even signalling for a short period. Most SWR^» (South Western Railway - about) trains stopped where they were for 30 minutes and then started up, not all immediately, and were not in their paths for some time.

Mortlake  is a busy crossing (about 14 tph^▸ (trains per hour)) and the timetable tries to have trains arrive in clusters, leaving several gaps of over 5 minutes in each hour. But opening the barriers depends that gap in the trains happening, and on knowing in advance that it will. I imagine that was difficult today.

[froome]

When was this? The communications failure at around midday affected not just GSM-R^▸ (Global System for Mobile communications - Railway. A simple mobile phone that has been fitted to the turbos to allow them to operate on lines that are not covered by the cab secure radio (CSR). This allows the Network Rail control centre to send simple STOP messages to the driver or the driver to contact the controller in emergency only. When this system is in operation a guard must be provided when in passenger operation.), but phones and even signalling for a short period. Most SWR^» (South Western Railway - about) trains stopped where they were for 30 minutes and then started up, not all immediately, and were not in their paths for some time.

Mortlake  is a busy crossing (about 14 tph^▸ (trains per hour)) and the timetable tries to have trains arrive in clusters, leaving several gaps of over 5 minutes in each hour. But opening the barriers depends that gap in the trains happening, and on knowing in advance that it will. I imagine that was difficult today.

Both were on Saturday afternoon, probably about 2.30pm and then about 4.30pm.

[stuving]

Both were on Saturday afternoon, probably about 2.30pm and then about 4.30pm.

In that case I got the wrong day - if anything the trains were running too regularly. There are 12 tph^▸ (trains per hour), and if they arrive spaced close to 5 minutes apart there are none of the longer gaps. On that Saturday there were several trains a minute or two early or late and that's all it takes. The other factor is the personal style of the operator - some are more inclined to whip the barriers up whenever possible, others more cautious.

I'm not sure where the operators sit for that one, and whether they are crossings-only operators or signallers. It was quite noticeable when Wokingham went over from local operation by the signaller to specialsed operators at Basingstoke ROC^▸ (Rail Operating Centre - a centralised location for railway signalling and train control operations for a specific route or region) that the barriers were raised much sooner after a train had passed.

[Witham Bobby]

Barriers (well, certainly most of them) that are locally or CCTV^▸ (Closed Circuit TeleVision) supervised in track-circuited areas are default-set to auto raise as soon as the circuit over the level crossing goes clear.  Obviously that doesn't happen if the barriers are down for a train passing over the crossing on another line

Some crossing keepers/signalmen used to switch off this setting so that their action would initiate the raising of the barriers.  They were either bloody minded antagonistic people, or they had too much time on their hands

[Bob_Blakey]

A related question.

On my cycle wanderings I regularly use the Stoke Canon Level Crossing. The crossing is CCTV^▸ (Closed Circuit TeleVision)-equipped and has split full width barriers.

On a number of occasions the barriers have been closed for up to 8 minutes - yes, I have timed it - for the passing of 3 services.

This is not, I think, what you would call an intensively worked section of line. Is this entirely down to the local signalling configuration (long track sections) or decisions made by the signallers (who I believe are based at the Exeter Box)?

[Witham Bobby]

A related question.

On my cycle wanderings I regularly use the Stoke Canon Level Crossing. The crossing is CCTV^▸ (Closed Circuit TeleVision)-equipped and has split full width barriers.

On a number of occasions the barriers have been closed for up to 8 minutes - yes, I have timed it - for the passing of 3 services.

This is not, I think, what you would call an intensively worked section of line. Is this entirely down to the local signalling configuration (long track sections) or decisions made by the signallers (who I believe are based at the Exeter Box)?

If you have Train 1 on the Down Main, Train 2 on the Up Main, and Train 3 on the Down:

Barriers dropped, say two minutes before Train 1 arrives at the crossing, so the driver gets greens on the approach.  The first signal that could give a yellow could be 1,800m or so in rear of the crossing, and you don't want the driver to see that as yellow as the train approaches, you want the driver to see a green. At a line speed of 80mph, say, you really do need to start those barriers dropping two minutes before the train gets there.  There will probably be an annunciator in the signalbox, to give awareness that the train is approaching, at a certain distance in rear of the crossing - a track circuit or a treadle

Say it's 2 minutes 20 seconds before Train 1 has cleared the crossing.  By which time, Train 2 could be within three minutes of arrival.  You wont lift the barriers to drop them again in less than a minute.  So they stay down.

Train 2 clears the crossing 5 minutes 40 seconds after the barriers were dropped.  And now Train 3 is about, following  maybe four minutes behind Train 1 on the Down, and not much more than three minutes from the crossing.  Again, you don't want to lift the barriers.  Train 3 arrives at the crossing 8 minutes or more after the barriers were first dropped

This is a general explanation, not specific to Stoke Canon Crossing. It works for two-aspect signals.   But it does give you an idea of why you'd have to wait there for a while, sometimes.  With three aspect signals, when you wouldn't want to show the driver a double yellow even further in rear of the crossing, the barriers may need to be dropped earlier.  Just admire the Saxby and Farmer built signalbox.  A listed building, I believe, and disused for around 40 years now

[John D]

When I used to live Kingston -Richmond borders occasionally used the level crossing by Sheen station.    Have waited for 5 trains to pass.

Get a bit of late running and mix of stopper on Kingston loop, faster trains to Windsor or Reading trains can be just 2-4 minutes apart, get a train going other way between them and just insufficient time to put barriers up.

Before SWR^» (South Western Railway - about) thinned the timetable 6 years ago (and never fully restored it post covid), barriers could be down for around 35-40 minutes each hour in the peak