Wrexham and Shropshire introduce Flat Fare policy

[whole diary]

[vacman]

I agree that barriers are useful for commuter routes where the distances travelled are relatively short and the trains are very busy that it'd be almost impossible to manually check all tickets.

But I think barriers are a waste of time on all long distance routes particularly if they're going to be used by the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) to reduce onboard ticket checks (like NXEC^▸ (National Express East Coast) is planning to do once barriers are installed on the East Coast).

There's just too many ways of getting round it. If they're happy to let you through to see off friends, use a cash machine or board the open access operator that sells tickets on board then you can quite as easily jump on another train and if they've cut back on ticket inspections then you're in for a free ride.

Even if they don't let people through without a ticket and platform tickets aren't available you can easily buy the ticket to the cheapest destination from that station.

I'm inclined to agree with you about where barriers should be located, problem with the western region is that our large stations on long distance routes are also served by many local stopping trains, at the end of the day i'd love it to be possible to not have any barriers anywhere but modern society has dictated the need to bring them back as you just can't trust anyone these days!

[paul7575]

I agree that barriers are useful for commuter routes where the distances travelled are relatively short and the trains are very busy that it'd be almost impossible to manually check all tickets.

So what's your solution when pax^▸ (passengers) are using 'long distance routes' for short distance commuting?

How about for example, Durham - Newcastle commuters on the ECML^▸ (East Coast Main Line)? Ban them from NXEC^▸ (National Express East Coast) and TPE^▸ (Trans Pennine Express) services perhaps?  Or do you leave all the barriers at Southampton open for 10 minutes just before the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) service leaves for Cardiff, or the XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) service to Man Picc shows up, because it's long distance?

Basically, defining routes as commuter or long distance isn't at all straightforward once you look into it in detail. 

Paul

[Btline]

Do I take it, Btline, that you would refuse W&S^▸ (Wrexham and Shropshire (Open Access Operator)) passengers and trainspotters access to platforms at gated stations?

Yes! If you don't have a ticket - you should not be allowed onto the platform. Go and buy one like everyone else...

If you can just get through willy nilly as people on here seem to suggest , the whole point of the barriers (to ensure as far as possible that everyone boarding and alighting from trains at the station has a ticket) is being compromised, and you might as well get rid.

If you are not travelling - get a platform ticket/ the cheapest ticket possible.

As far as gating is concerned: Of course, in an ideal world - 100 % of stations would be gated. But this is not practical. So gate every major station. Most termini (including ALL holiday resorts) and major interchange points should be done.

That is what LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise) have done. They have created a "ring of steel" around Birmingham, by gating the main 5 central stations. From that, they can maximise revenue protection whilst minimising the no of barriers.

Ticket checks should NOT be reduced - indeed, with less people wasting guards' time by buying tickets onboard - even more and enhanced checks should be able to be carried out.

[BringBackGNER]

So what's your solution when pax^▸ (passengers) are using 'long distance routes' for short distance commuting?

How about for example, Durham - Newcastle commuters on the ECML^▸ (East Coast Main Line)? Ban them from NXEC^▸ (National Express East Coast) and TPE^▸ (Trans Pennine Express) services perhaps?  Or do you leave all the barriers at Southampton open for 10 minutes just before the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) service leaves for Cardiff, or the XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) service to Man Picc shows up, because it's long distance?

Basically, defining routes as commuter or long distance isn't at all straightforward once you look into it in detail. 

Paul

My main criticism of barriers is that they're so easy to circumvent if you don't want to pay the correct fare that it's quite easy to do so. If the barriers are there then they might as well be used but the problem is some operators are using it as an excuse to cut staff. The longer the route, the more money that can be saved by fare dodging and without the on-train checks it'll be trivially easy to get through the barriers with the wrong ticket.