Weather disruption caused in 2014, and how to prevent it happening again - ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[Henry]

 
  Watching with fascination the Kingskerswell By-pass being constructed, I sometimes wonder if a
  task of rebuilding a railway line is beyond the capability of Network Rail.
  The  '6-week-fix' will not cure a problem that we have debated every winter.
 
  Perhaps a professional civil engineering company should be employed.
  Someone with experience who can not only save the properties of the poor people
  who live alongside the line, but have the ability to maybe 'cure' the problem of a fragile
 railway environment.

[Henry]

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2014-02-09/shipping-containers-provide-flood-defence-at-dawlish/

 

[ChrisB]

Won't the waves just crash over the top - I assume they're only 6' containers?

[ellendune]

  Watching with fascination the Kingskerswell By-pass being constructed, I sometimes wonder if a
  task of rebuilding a railway line is beyond the capability of Network Rail.
  The  '6-week-fix' will not cure a problem that we have debated every winter.
 
  Perhaps a professional civil engineering company should be employed.
  Someone with experience who can not only save the properties of the poor people
  who live alongside the line, but have the ability to maybe 'cure' the problem of a fragile
 railway environment.

Network Rail are professional Civil Engineers and certainly the team at Dawlish are very experienced in emergency coastal protection - perhaps more so than contractors who only build things in a planned way according to drawings produced by others. However they do make extensive use of 'professional' contractors both for planned and emergency works.  Certainly the link posed by Henry ....

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2014-02-09/shipping-containers-provide-flood-defence-at-dawlish/

...suggests they have no shortage of ingenuity in finding a solution.

Of course a 6 week fix will not be a long term solution, but everyone wants the line back up and running as soon as possible.  That is the nature of emergency works.

Won't the waves just crash over the top - I assume they're only 6' containers?

Containers are normally higher than that 9ft or 9'6"?  However I assume they are only part of the solution.  And of course you can stack them.

[ChrisB]

The new containers are 9'....but I can't think many are yet redundant of that size.

[ellendune]

The new containers are 9'....but I can't think many are yet redundant of that size.

Ah yes the ones that are redundant are the 8ft ones presumably then. 

[ChrisB]

Indeed, and the waves were a heck of a lot taller than that. If you stacked them, would the power behind the water not just knock 'em flat? If it can demolish a sea wall, stacked containers won't last long.

[didcotdean]

Local media reporting that as a result of flooding at Redbridge it is quite likely that Oxford may only have an hourly shuttle service to Didcot tomorrow.

An FGW^▸ (First Great Western) spokesman is quoted as saying: "Coaches have been ordered and will be used if the line needs to be closed or to support demand."

Situation this morning from a Lee Edworthy tweet:

[stuving]

Indeed, and the waves were a heck of a lot taller than that. If you stacked them, would the power behind the water not just knock 'em flat? If it can demolish a sea wall, stacked containers won't last long.

I don't think that's how seawalls work. Those spectacular pictures of waves showed water being thrown upwards, not coming horizontally over the top. The bulk of the wave hits the wall lower down, and can only go upwards - so it pushes any water heading to overtop the wall upwards. Some seawalls are curved at the base to encourage this, but all do it.

Of course the water that shoots upwards has to come down, and water is very heavy. So the top of the wall takes a pounding, but from all directions. The Dawlsih wall was made of quite small blocks of masonry, mortared together - and mortar is not as strong material. So the wall can be taken down a block at a time. Big single lumps, if heavy enough, resist that. They might move a millimetre or so, but that's OK.

I think NR^» (Network Rail - home page) must have spent a lot of time remortaring blocks into the top of the wall, both after storms and routinely. Then along comes a storm big and strong enough to take the wall right down before any repair is possible. Once the embankment can be washed out, there's nothing behind the wall pushing back and it just gets pushed over.

[JayMac]

Moderator note: I've renamed this topic again, widening it out further as there are now weather related issues in the Thames Valley.

[CLPGMS]

Local media reporting that as a result of flooding at Redbridge it is quite likely that Oxford may only have an hourly shuttle service to Didcot tomorrow.

It certainly would not be surprising if flooding occurred again south of Oxford.  There were massive amounts of water on the fields alongside the railway track in the Evenlode Valley between Charlbury and Moreton-in-Marsh when I travelled in that direction on Friday, and all that will eventually find its way into the River Thames just north of Oxford.

[ChrisB]

The Environment Agency warned NR^» (Network Rail - home page) on Friday of further likely flooding....

[PhilWakely]

Returning to the Exeter to Paddington services..... I notice the 'can they/can't they run services over the SR^▸ (Southern Railway / Southern Region / Scot Rail / Scottish Region (rather confusing - it depends on the context)) line' question appears to have been resolved and that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) services will now run again all the way from Exeter to Paddington, but still over the SR route despite Whiteball being available again, using the same timetable as per the last three weeks.

quote from SWT^▸ (South West Trains) website....
Monday 10 February
First Great Western services are currently diverted via our route between Yeovil Junction and Exeter St Davids. We have been advised that this will continue on Monday 10 February 2014.
To allow this to occur we will be operating an amended timetable......

[Red Squirrel]

NR^» (Network Rail - home page) have published a short YouTube vid of a crane dropping rocks into an old container...

[SandTEngineer]

Returning to the Exeter to Paddington services..... I notice the 'can they/can't they run services over the SR^▸ (Southern Railway / Southern Region / Scot Rail / Scottish Region (rather confusing - it depends on the context)) line' question appears to have been resolved and that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) services will now run again all the way from Exeter to Paddington, but still over the SR route despite Whiteball being available again, using the same timetable as per the last three weeks.

quote from SWT^▸ (South West Trains) website....
Monday 10 February
First Great Western services are currently diverted via our route between Yeovil Junction and Exeter St Davids. We have been advised that this will continue on Monday 10 February 2014.
To allow this to occur we will be operating an amended timetable......

That's a bit strange as it conflicts with FGW information I posted here: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=13068.msg147985#msg147985