China Train Crash leaves at least 35 people dead

[whole diary]

[thetrout]

From the Independent:

A bullet train crashed into another high-speed train in eastern China, killing at least 35 people, injuring 191 others and once again raising safety concerns about the country's fast-expanding rail network.

The first train was traveling south from the Zhejiang provincial capital of Hangzhou yesterday evening when it lost power in a lightning strike and stalled, before being hit from behind by the second train in Wenzhou city, the official Xinhua News Agency said.

Full Article:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/at-least-35-killed-in-china-train-crash-2319693.html

[broadgage]

Seems like a lack of basic signalling.
Signal failure ? Driver of second train did not respond to the signal?

Press reports seem to concentrate on the lack of power on the first train which was disabled by lightning.
But even basic signalling should not be reliant on any power source on the train which is of course vulnerable.

Human observation, and then track circuits, and more recently axle counters, have been used to ensure that the whole train has safey passed through a section before a second train may be admitted.
This has been a basic principle for decades, and is especialy important at higher speeds.

No mention of what signalling system was in use.

[ChrisB]

ERTMS^▸ (European Rail Traffic Management System. A future railway signalling system, with equipment located in the driver's cab, rather than lineside) in-cab that failed? Don't know how long the failed train had been stationary? The second might have only been minutes behind?

[thetrout]

Both trains were destined for the same destination.

But may I suggest that we do not speculate into what has happened, until it has become common knowledge!

As always, thoughts are with those involved.

[ChrisB]

I think its probably common knowledge - it was in my morning papers today - happen ed over the weekend.

[JayMac]

As far as I'm aware, newspapers are not charged with investigating rail crashes. They can speculate and quote 'sources' but that can't be taken as definitive.

[ChrisB]

so?.....informed guesses can surely be discussed?

If not, what's the point of leaving the thread open?

[eightf48544]

Hopefully the Railway press will cover this tragic incident.

Can't expect the national papers to understand they still think railway siganlling is simialr to roads with traffic lights which go to red  randomly just as the train approches. The concept of blocks protected by a signal indicating stop, which only changes to a proceed indication when the block is clear is beyond their comprehension. They wouldn't know a Track circuit from an axle counter or balaise.

[paul7575]

I'm rather surprised the 'anti HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)) lobby' haven't jumped on this story as a reason not to build it.  Mr Wolmar must be on holiday...

Note the gratuitous use of the term 'bullet train' in most articles - presumably that's just to amplify the problem, whatever it eventually turns out to be.

Paul

[broadgage]

This report suggests a fault in the signaling system, though it gives little detail.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-14321060

[Worcester_Passenger]

I think that this accident will end up being more important politically.

The news reports that I've read, including http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/25/world/asia/25train.html?_r=2 from the New York Times, are describing the way in which the official media are trying to cover up the accident. Including an astonishing suggestion that some of the wreckage has been buried at the crash site (without the thorough examination that would be done over here). Perhaps the apparatchiks are hoping for the ultimate case of out of sight, out of mind. But I don't think they'll succeed.

[broadgage]

Interesting article in todays Times, refers to the political/financial impact of this accident.
Whilst burying or otherwise disposing of the wreckage without thorough examination is not how we would do it, it must be said that detailed examination of the wrecked train probably would not reveal anything.

There has been no suggestion of brake failure or other mechanical failure on the train, therefore perhaps not much point in examining it.
Reports strongly suggest either failure of the signaling equipment, or human error in the use of this equipment.
Therefore it is the signalling equipment and persons connected with it that require examination, not the wreckage of the train.