| Re: 07:00 Manchester - Euston Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 18:25, 29th November 2025 |     |
From the BBC:
Manchester to London train to run without passengers
Avanti says the decision by the Office of Rail and Road is "disappointing"
A train service taking commuters from Manchester to London is to run empty for around five months following a decision by the rail regulator.
A decision by the Office of Rail and Road (ORR), means the 07:00 GMT service operated by Avanti West Coast from Manchester Piccadilly to London will still run but will only be used to carry staff from mid-December.
An Avanti West Coast spokesperson said they were "disappointed" with the decision, which would "clearly impact those customers who already use these services".
An ORR spokesperson said the decision was made on "robust evidence" from Network Rail to guard against possible service disruption on the West Coast Main Line.
Network Rail declined to comment.
The fast service, which gets to London in under two hours, will still set off from Manchester Piccadilly at 07:00 on four weekdays, but will not be available to commuters. It will, instead, ferry Avanti staff from Manchester to London when the new timetable launches on 15 December. The decision means the service could run for more than 100 journeys without paying passengers on board.
An Avanti West Coast spokesperson said they were disappointed with the ORR's decision not to grant access rights from December for four weekday services that they currently operated, including the 07:00 fast service from Manchester to London.
The ORR also required a Sunday service which currently runs from Holyhead to London to terminate at Crewe, they added. "This will clearly impact those customers who already use these services," they said. "However, we will still be delivering even more services across our network from the start of the December timetable, including further additional trains on our Liverpool route."
The spokesperson confirmed that the services being removed were:
07:00 GMT: Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston (Monday to Friday)
12:52 GMT: Blackpool North – London Euston (Monday to Friday)
09:39 GMT: London Euston – Blackpool North (Monday to Friday)
19:32 GMT: Chester – London Euston (Monday to Friday)
17:53 GMT: Holyhead – London Euston terminates at Crewe (Sunday)
An ORR spokesperson said: "Our decision on the Manchester-London service was based on robust evidence provided by Network Rail that adding services within 'firebreak' paths on the West Coast Main Line would have a detrimental impact on performance. We identified that this service would run in one of those paths. If Avanti operates the service as empty coaching stock (ECS), ECS can be run more flexibly (delayed or re-routed) than a booked passenger service. This can assist with performance management and service recovery during disruption."
The ORR said Avanti was previously given the right to run this service from May 2025 for the duration of one timetable period only. This was on the basis that First Lumo's Stirling services were not operating at the time but the First Lumo services are expected to begin operating during the December 2025 timetable period.
The ORR added that under the new timetable, new open access train services, run by First Lumo to Stirling in Scotland, were due to start.
Avanti says the decision by the Office of Rail and Road is "disappointing"
A train service taking commuters from Manchester to London is to run empty for around five months following a decision by the rail regulator.
A decision by the Office of Rail and Road (ORR), means the 07:00 GMT service operated by Avanti West Coast from Manchester Piccadilly to London will still run but will only be used to carry staff from mid-December.
An Avanti West Coast spokesperson said they were "disappointed" with the decision, which would "clearly impact those customers who already use these services".
An ORR spokesperson said the decision was made on "robust evidence" from Network Rail to guard against possible service disruption on the West Coast Main Line.
Network Rail declined to comment.
The fast service, which gets to London in under two hours, will still set off from Manchester Piccadilly at 07:00 on four weekdays, but will not be available to commuters. It will, instead, ferry Avanti staff from Manchester to London when the new timetable launches on 15 December. The decision means the service could run for more than 100 journeys without paying passengers on board.
An Avanti West Coast spokesperson said they were disappointed with the ORR's decision not to grant access rights from December for four weekday services that they currently operated, including the 07:00 fast service from Manchester to London.
The ORR also required a Sunday service which currently runs from Holyhead to London to terminate at Crewe, they added. "This will clearly impact those customers who already use these services," they said. "However, we will still be delivering even more services across our network from the start of the December timetable, including further additional trains on our Liverpool route."
The spokesperson confirmed that the services being removed were:
07:00 GMT: Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston (Monday to Friday)
12:52 GMT: Blackpool North – London Euston (Monday to Friday)
09:39 GMT: London Euston – Blackpool North (Monday to Friday)
19:32 GMT: Chester – London Euston (Monday to Friday)
17:53 GMT: Holyhead – London Euston terminates at Crewe (Sunday)
An ORR spokesperson said: "Our decision on the Manchester-London service was based on robust evidence provided by Network Rail that adding services within 'firebreak' paths on the West Coast Main Line would have a detrimental impact on performance. We identified that this service would run in one of those paths. If Avanti operates the service as empty coaching stock (ECS), ECS can be run more flexibly (delayed or re-routed) than a booked passenger service. This can assist with performance management and service recovery during disruption."
The ORR said Avanti was previously given the right to run this service from May 2025 for the duration of one timetable period only. This was on the basis that First Lumo's Stirling services were not operating at the time but the First Lumo services are expected to begin operating during the December 2025 timetable period.
The ORR added that under the new timetable, new open access train services, run by First Lumo to Stirling in Scotland, were due to start.
| Re: 07:00 Manchester - Euston Posted by ChrisB at 14:23, 29th November 2025 | |
It was.....not NR
| Re: 07:00 Manchester - Euston Posted by Bob_Blakey at 14:12, 29th November 2025 | |
.....Network Rail have withdrawn the authorisation for this passenger service.....
Surely that would be a decision for the ORR?
| Re: 07:00 Manchester - Euston Posted by rogerw at 12:20, 29th November 2025 | |
I have read somewhere that Network Rail have withdrawn the authorisation for this passenger service because of congestion. However the stock still has to get to Euston
| Re: 07:00 Manchester - Euston Posted by Mark A at 09:05, 29th November 2025 | |
“If Avanti operates the service as empty coaching stock, [it] can be run more flexibly – delayed or rerouted – than a booked passenger service. This can assist with performance management and service recovery during disruption.”
Well of course the railway runs more to time without passengers. But...
If I were the secretary of state for transport I'd be planning an intervention this morning.
Mark
| 07:00 Manchester - Euston Posted by Worcester_Passenger at 07:52, 29th November 2025 | |
From the December timetable change, this train will run to Euston empty : see https://www.theguardian.com/business/2025/nov/29/avanti-axed-7am-manchester-london-train-will-run-without-passengers.
You couldn't make it up.
