Campaign for Tavistock reopening

[whole diary]

[grahame]

The aspiration is an hourly service between Plymouth and Tavistock (or as near that as possible) so I think the text error is simply a typo.

Yes, if that's the aspiration a typo seems likely.   And from some very rough back-of-envelope calculations, something around hourly would seem appropriate for Tavistock;  I'm sure your very much aware, though, that an appropriate service for passengers doesn't always get provided when there are other parties such as government, shareholders and operational convenience to consider.

[Plymboi]

Consultation is today in tavistock. Is anyone going?

[34104]

Consultation is today in tavistock. Is anyone going?

I'll be going to the one at Bere Alston station tomorrow afternoon and will post as to what it's all about afterwards.If anyone has any particular questions,please let me know and i'll endeavour to get answers.

[trainbuff]

I went to the Tavistock one tonight. Asked particularly about the layout changes proposed at Bere Alston. Apparently, the preferred plan is to build out the former up Platform. Open doors on both sides so as people can board/alight for either changing to/from Gunnislake or for normal alighting/boarding at Bere Alston.

The man I spoke to described it as Network Rails preferred solution. Ie trains running between Plymouth and Tavistock with a unit shuttling between Bere Alston and Gunnislake to connect into. Leaving the train locked in. Though the plan he quickly scribbled did not show ANY connection to the main line. when I mentioned a loop or kickback siding instead, he seemed to think that Network rail thought it was more expensive. There would still have to be the same number of points, (2) with the kickback siding, if connection remained and if the unit went up in the morning it would have to confirm with Plymouth that it was 'Locked In'

Spoke to him a while about the Parry People Mover at Stourbridge. Maybe that would be suitable as a shuttle....light rail on Bere Alston- Gunny section....if it could cope with the gradients and curvature.  He apparently didn't know about this and noted it down to investigate.

There were many people there and I didnt want to monopolise him when so many others wished to speak to hinm and his colleagues.

I guess that one of the things i should have asked was if this plan was the ultimate aspiration or a development over and above Killbrides proposals. Perhaps 34104 could ask if possible.

Was good to see many people going to see the proposals, though how many were pro or anti I do not know. There information did contain dates for the Public Inquiry as not being likely to be held until 2014 or 2015

[Southern Stag]

Spoke to him a while about the Parry People Mover at Stourbridge. Maybe that would be suitable as a shuttle....light rail on Bere Alston- Gunny section....if it could cope with the gradients and curvature.  He apparently didn't know about this and noted it down to investigate.

I'm not convinced a PPM^‡(resolve) would be able to cope with the Bere Alston-Gunnislake section. The ride quality is poor enough on the Stourbridge line, much worse than a pacer. And pacers were removed rather quickly after introduction to the Gunnislake line.

[Plymboi]

I hate the idea of building out the up platform yuk. Would ruin the picturesque image of the station and be so confusing for passengers. And the whole chaming at Bere Alston for gunnislake, is that not against the franchise tender which states the tavistock service would not impact on the daily plymouth to gunnislake services.

Also against PPM^‡(resolve) used on the gunnislake branch, that would be awful as stated before it would not suit the line and be very shaken indeed.

[trainer]

I agree that the PPM^‡(resolve) would not be suitable for the Bere Alston - Gunnislake section because of it's geography, but I am surprised that an employee of Network Rail looking at possibilities for new lines and services had not even heard of them.  He should at least have been able to say they had discounted this solution from knowledge, I would have thought.

Thanks for the update trainbuff.

[Chris from Nailsea]

I went to the Tavistock one tonight.
...
There were many people there and I didnt want to monopolise him when so many others wished to speak to him and his colleagues.
...
Was good to see many people going to see the proposals, though how many were pro or anti I do not know.

Indeed: thanks very much for that useful update here, trainbuff - and for your consideration for other attendees there! 

[bobm]

Open doors on both sides so as people can board/alight for either changing to/from Gunnislake or for normal alighting/boarding at Bere Alston.

I thought opening doors on both sides was frowned on by the modern railway.  They certainly stopped the procedure at Ascot and I think Guildford.  Trains in the old Platform 6 at Reading only open their doors on one side - but that may be more because the platform is not long enough for five coach trains on one side.  Can't remember what the arrangements were for the old Platform 7 bay at Reading.

[Southern Stag]

At Ascot and Guildford it's because of the third rail. Opening the doors on the same side as the third rail is frowned upon. However the Central Line at Stratford now opens doors on both sides of the platform.

[RichardB]

Just a few things picking up on people's comments -

The key objective here is, of course, to provide the best possible service (in the most cost effective way) on both the new line to Tavistock and the existing one to Gunnislake.

The idea of running a core Plymouth - Tavistock service with a shuttle Bere Alston - Gunnislake allows a train to run about every hour and a quarter between Plymouth and Tavistock with a more frequent service than now on the Gunnislake line, albeit with a change.  You would make a great connection with trains coming into Plymouth in the morning, switching to making a great connection from Plymouth trains in the afternoon.   

Running alternate through trains Plymouth - Gunnislake and Plymouth - Tavistock would mean each destination would only see a train every two and a bit hours and, worse still, you would have to chose whether Tavistock or Gunnislake had the core commuter services (Plymouth arrive by 08 30 and depart 16 30 ish).

Splitting and joining trains at Bere Alston would solve this issue but would mean that Bere Alston would need to be fully signalled, from Plymouth.   That would come with a big price tag which can be simply avoided with the option that is being persued.

Building out the old up platform avoids the need for an expensive (^1 m plus) ramped footbridge and FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are comfortable with opening the doors on both sides at Bere Alston (it happens - or can happen - at Yeovil Pen Mill, evidently).  The reason for using the old up platform rather than reinstating the original branch platform is because the up platform was rebuilt in 1961 and hardly used so is in very good condition for its age.  The branch platform would need to be completely rebuilt.

Hope this helps.

[swrural]

Come down in the world from this though.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bere_Alston_railway_station_1972579_ddf00a12.jpg

The branch bridge is still intact.  Can the Gunnislake line not run out on its own bridge (11 foot headway on both)?  For maintenance, there is good access at GUN (guessing here) to take the unit out on a trailer.

This would preserve the Tavistock line for the mainline running when it is re-instated to Okehampton  as the strategic solution.  The interchange can be on that joint platform (as was) and just a non-step walkway under the two bridges to the village (it's only a road to a farm and you've got to walk along that anyway from either platform.

I'm not local and probably shews.   

[trainbuff]

Just a few things picking up on people's comments -

The key objective here is, of course, to provide the best possible service (in the most cost effective way) on both the new line to Tavistock and the existing one to Gunnislake.

The idea of running a core Plymouth - Tavistock service with a shuttle Bere Alston - Gunnislake allows a train to run about every hour and a quarter between Plymouth and Tavistock with a more frequent service than now on the Gunnislake line, albeit with a change.  You would make a great connection with trains coming into Plymouth in the morning, switching to making a great connection from Plymouth trains in the afternoon.   

Running alternate through trains Plymouth - Gunnislake and Plymouth - Tavistock would mean each destination would only see a train every two and a bit hours and, worse still, you would have to chose whether Tavistock or Gunnislake had the core commuter services (Plymouth arrive by 08 30 and depart 16 30 ish).

Splitting and joining trains at Bere Alston would solve this issue but would mean that Bere Alston would need to be fully signalled, from Plymouth.   That would come with a big price tag which can be simply avoided with the option that is being persued.

Building out the old up platform avoids the need for an expensive (^1 m plus) ramped footbridge and FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are comfortable with opening the doors on both sides at Bere Alston (it happens - or can happen - at Yeovil Pen Mill, evidently).  The reason for using the old up platform rather than reinstating the original branch platform is because the up platform was rebuilt in 1961 and hardly used so is in very good condition for its age.  The branch platform would need to be completely rebuilt.

Hope this helps.

Hi again. I agree with a lot said here. Though this is just one option. It is not the be all and end all. Also I probably did not explain well enough but the intention to build out the up platform....in SR^‡(resolve) parlance.....would not be for the whole length. It would form a bay with stop blocks for the Gunny service

[chaulender]

I'm sure avoiding the need for a footbridge will be a key consideration.  But how does this proposal avoid that?  How would a passenger aligting from a Gunnislake train exit the station?  Or is there alternative access from that platform into the village (ie: not via the current platform)?

[swrural]

According to me you can exit the station one side or the other (see my earlier post).