It is regretably true that a significant minority of passengers leave trains, and in particular train toilets in an appaling state.

However some of the instances refered to above, are at least partly the fault of the railway.
Take the example of the toilet pan filled with s**t. Presumably the first few passengers to leave it like that did at least attempt to flush away the waste, without succes (due to lack of water or other fault)
Even if a passenger ommited to flush, then the next one would presumably try.

Therefore a toilet in the state described is largely the fault of the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) (or the fault of a sub contractor whom they appointed)
Why did it not flush ? Mechanical failure, then fix it. Frequent mechanical failure=defective design, flush toilets have been around for 100 years now so it should be possible to design a reliable and idiot resistant unit.

Lack of water for flushing ? then fill the water tank ! Frequent lack of water=tank too small or intervals between fillings are too great.


Retention tank full ? then empty it !

Retention tank regularly full in service=then either the tank is too small or the intervals between emtpying are too great.

One must expect the odd problem when trains are away from their proper places for servicing due to bad weather etc.
However regular disgusting problems such as described suggest a lack of maintenance, lack of cleaning, or defective design.

There is no excuse for passengers adding needlesly to mess, dirt or filth.
But in the case described of an overfull WC^▸ (Wiltshire Council (Unitary Authority)) pan, what are they meant to do ?
Pull the emergency alarm ? Use the floor ?

Cant imagine that the HMRI^▸ (Her Majesty's Railway Inspectorate) would investigate, it is not really a railway, not even light rail or tramway, which is within the remit of HMRI.
I would presume that if investigation is warrented that this will be by the police and/or the HSE^▸ (Health and Safety Executive).

Suprised that no one else has posted this.
Most services to/from the West cancelled, including tonights sleeper.
West country services from Waterloo as bad.

(source BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) news, but widely reported)

Agreed.
Most railway platforms are very low risk enviroments as regards needing means of escape. They built of substantialy non combustible materials, with few sources of ignition.

In the most unlikely event of say a terrorist bomb explosion, evacuation to a tunnel or overhead walkway might not be the best option due to the risks of a second bomb.


In the event of fire or other emergency in the ticket office or on the concourse, it is often best to close the station to arriving passengers, but to evacuate those on the platforms by train.
And as a last resort, there is always evacuation to track level after stopping the trains.

Whilst in a perfect world all platforms would be under shelter, in todays economic climate I can think of more important uses for the money.
Including buying an extra train ! and yes even one more could make a difference, not by any extra timetabled services but by reducing cancellations and short formations "due to lack of rolling stock"

A light aircraft is aguably easier to control than a car or a train.
In the air, if one mistakes the position of another aircraft, or the position of a hill, there is often the chance to take last minute evasive action.
In the cab of a train, the misreading of a signal can result in large scale loss of life, even if the mistake is realised, it may be too late to avert disaster.


The controls of most trains are not that complicated, the extensive training is mainly learning the route, the numerous regulations and rules, and the actions to take in case of failures.

I have driven a steam locomotive on a heritage line, after a days instruction and would feel  competant to do so even with passengers. Would I be passed as competant to drive a steam or other locomotive on the main line ? no way!

A backward step IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion).
I dont like duvets, and am far from alone in this.
Duvets are increasingly looked upon as the "cheap and nasty" option favoured by budget hotels and the less well off.
Polyester duvets are hot and sweaty, and feather ones are prone to damage, not readily washed, and some people are allergic to them.

A duvet cover is roughly the size and weight of two sheets, therefore twice as much water, fuel, and detergent used to wash it, as compared to a sheet.

I was not aware that one could book in the up Pullmans ?
I thought that booking was only possible on the 18-03 and 19-03 from Paddington, until recently there was no need for bookings on up services, as space was virtualy allways available.
With the recent increase in numbers dining on up services, there might be a need for a booking service, or has this been introduced, unoticed by myself?

Just back in London after visiting friends in the West.
The restaurant on on the 18-03 last week was of the usuall high standard, and the return today on the 12-05 from Plymouth was as good.
I was especialy pleased to note that on todays train, that only 1 or 2 seats remained in the restaurant, with about 16 customers taking lunch.
Hopefully the service will ccontinue and perhaps be increased.

Agree, not news

FGW^▸ (First Great Western) certainly have their faults but are not IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion) that bad.
I feel that a lot of the anti-first group publicity is from people whose main experience of First group is say First capital connect, still commonly called Thameslink.
Anyone regulary subjected to FCC^▸ (First Capital Connect) would probably be appalled at the thought of giving another franchise to that lot.

And of course a few probably think that 4 car class 319s will be used between Euston and Scotland!

A cynic might suspect that the often rumoured re-instatment of FGW^▸ (First Great Western) pullmans was due to the rapidly approaching franchise renewal on the Great western route and the West coast.
Now that the west coast fiasco has delayed this, there is no point in re-instating any Pullmans just yet.

I predict a short term re-instatement when the franchise renewal process restarts.

Officialy the franchise for the west coast will be granted on facts and figures and not on public opinion, nor on the catering offer on another franchise run by the same company. In practice though I expect that public opinion, or the subjective impressions of those making the decision may play a part.

I have never even found a travelling chef service on a rail replacement bus, perhaps I should complain!
No seat reservations or first class either.

The dislike of rail replacement buses is not just a matter of the vehicle itself often being inferior to a train, but also the risks of incidents like that to which I refer above.
To be delayed by an hour, as advertised due to a connecting bus, is arguably fair enough. To be delayed by several hours, and have to stand for much of that time, and then be surcharged is not acceptable.

The other reason, IME^▸ (in my experience) that a through train is prefered, even if delayed/diverted, is that if one obtains a seat on the train then this seat may normally be utilised for the entire journey.
If changing to a bus and then another train, there is more risk of standing on the connecting service.

Buses are generaly considered to be slower and inferior, but cheap.
In the case of local or suburban rail trips, a rail replacement bus can take a lot longer than existing buses.
As an example, Nunhead to London Blackfriars is about 20 minutes by train.
In case of engineering work, a 30 minute bus ride to AFAIR Herne Hill is required, then a 30 minute wait for a train to London victoria, and then a London Underground trip back to Blackfriars.
And this involves a battle with Underground staff, "rail ticket. not valid on underground. penalty fare or I will call the police" This all takes 2 or 3 hours and at least one argument.
Or one could ignore the whole farce and use local buses, or drive, or stay at home.

I have never understood why they cant provide a bus to Blackfriars in this case.

You are of course correct, BUT in this case the RPI^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)) argued that passengers were at fault for not allowing extra time for engineering work. Some paid up, others threatened violence against the RPI and did not pay.
What other business would "fine" its paying customers for being delayed by an hour or more, beyond the advertised delay, and then having to stand.
The service in question left paddington at the advertised time, with an advertised bus link in the middle of the journey for those going to the far west. Only a single bus was provided and could not accomadate all those with through tickets.
Those who boarded the bus were delayed, but only by the advertised delay due to engineering work.
Those unable to board the bus for lack of space, had to wait for another bus, or perhaps for the same one to return. This meant that they boarded a latter train than the advertised one and were told that a "fine" was payable. "and dont even think about complaining about standing, it is YOUR FAULT for being on the wrong train"
The situation was complicated AFAIR by two different TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company). The first train, the bus, and the intended connecting train were FGW^▸ (First Great Western), and the train actually boarded was virgin cross country.
Strictly speaking, virgin might even have been right, but the whole episode showed the rail industry in a very poor light.

And BTW^▸ (by the way) they would not let me sit in first class, despite me having a first open ticket, valid on any service. They said first was only for virgin ticket holders.

A number of victims vowed "never again" and others offered encourgment to anyone who would "deal with" the RPI.

Imagine what would happen to a supermarket, if they kept customers waiting for longer than usual at the checkout, and then charged an extra ^100 for the delay.