FirstGroup trumps Virgin as frontrunner for WCML franchise (guardian 29/07/2012)

[whole diary]

[Rhydgaled]

BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page) Local News here (I'm near Greater Manchester at the moment, not at home in Wales) covered the 'First Group looking like they are going to take the ICWC^▸ (InterCity West Coast) franchise' story this evening. I think the woman said First bid ^7bn more than Virgin, so they got that bit wrong if I heard her correctly.

[TonyK]

^7 billion looks like an awful lot of wonga that the unfortunate passenger may have to find. Presumably, they will be able to pull out early to save the last billion or two, then get an extension to the franchise so they can make good their losses at Government expense?

For reasons I can't quite fathom, I shall be sorry if Virgin disappears from the railway scene, probably because we'll never hear any more announcements like the "delays due to a failed Virgin at Watford". Maybe Sir Richard will buy First Group, call it Virgin's First or similar.

[Electric train]

The former record seller seems to be getting bent out of shape http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/2012/08/02-surprise-west-coast-intervention-reported.html and using the "old pals act" and wonder if there is a threat to party funding   or am I just a cynic    I do find Crow and Branson odd bed fellow both using the "protecting jobs" argument

[vacman]

The rumour about having to hand back other franchises is rumoured to be a cluase in the new franchise that if the company tries to hand the keys back early then they will be stripped of the others.

[Electric train]

The rumour about having to hand back other franchises is rumoured to be a cluase in the new franchise that if the company tries to hand the keys back early then they will be stripped of the others.

I am not sure that would be very practical, DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) would not cope if a group as involved as First did that, also each franchise is its own contract so it might be possible to build it into new franchises I doubt it could be made retrospective

[ellendune]

The rumour about having to hand back other franchises is rumoured to be a cluase in the new franchise that if the company tries to hand the keys back early then they will be stripped of the others.

I am not sure that would be very practical, DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) would not cope if a group as involved as First did that, also each franchise is its own contract so it might be possible to build it into new franchises I doubt it could be made retrospective

It would be possible - a condition of the new contract could be that they agree to vary their existing contracts.  DfT would need some contingencies for direct operation though. 

[Btline]

What on earth is the point of delaying the announcmenet.

(a) Surely they know and have made a decision, unless Branson is offering his soul.

(b) It's been leaked anyway.

I sometimes despair at this country/world.

[John R]

Branson is a wily old soul, and will have the best lawyers on the case. I don't believe at this stage a counter offer would work, as it would require reopening the competition, else the other bidders would cry foul. But he could threaten a judicial review of the decision if his lawyers think they have a case.

But what could that case be? Anyone remember TVAM, which was put out of business when GMTV bid stupid money for the breakfast franchise. Only trouble was, it was so stupid that they couldn't afford it, and had to negotiate a reduced payment a year or so later.  Quite why the government of the day agreed to it escapes me, but they did. By that stage TVAM had ceased to exist, so they couldn't do anything about it.

But if the organisation still existed (as Virgin group would do), then they could potentially have a case if it could be proved that the original decision was unreasonable, as it probably would be if First failed to honour the terms.

All speculation of course, and as someone has pointed out, the bearded one appears to have breached the terms of bidding by going public, which may not help his case. And yes, they did negotiate a very hard deal when the original plan for 140mph was shelved, (see point above about having excellent lawyers), and there wasn't much the govt could do about it, so the civil servants in the DafT have probably not been favourably inclined toward them ever since.

[JayMac]

Lots of rumours flying round as to why the announcement on the ICWC^▸ (InterCity West Coast) franchise award has been delayed.

Funniest I've seen is speculation that SNCF^▸ (Societe Nationale des Chemins de fer Francais - French National Railways) have been successful with a late bid:

it's obviously in the bag for SNCF. The DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) are in negotiations about the fares for the Shrewsbury to Paris service. A few ministers aren't too happy about the WCML^▸ (West Coast Main Line) being renamed the LGV^▸ (Large Goods Vehicle) Britannique, but, hey, if the DfT manages to fill up the coffers, who cares?

 

0700 tomorrow 15/08/2012 (possibly), now that HMG have got the bad news about Jan 2013 fare rises out the way, when we'll hear who's won. Virgin Rail Group t/a Virgin Trains or First Group t/a First West Horizon Coast Trains or something like that. 

[Btline]

I'd wait a few more days, so the story is not linked to the fare increases.

Or they should have done it today so overshadow.

[JayMac]

All the speculation over recent days has ultimately stemmed from a loosed-lipped snivel servant at the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about).

"The ship of state, Bernard, is the only ship that leaks from the top." - Sir Humphrey Appleby

[JayMac]

Following the announcement that First Group have won the InterCity West Coast franchise further discussion and news items on this subject will continue in a new thread:

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=11138.0