Work for First still to do

[whole diary]

[BristolBusDanny]

While the fare changes are a good step forward Bristol still needs Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) style smart cards, and better disabled access on all bus routes so disabled passengers no longer feel like second class passengers. First should publish their single and return fares on their website so people know how much to expect to pay before boarding a bus, and we need lower fares outside of the new inner zone.

[grahame]

While the fare changes are a good step forward Bristol still needs Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) style smart cards, and better disabled access on all bus routes so disabled passengers no longer feel like second class passengers. First should publish their single and return fares on their website so people know how much to expect to pay before boarding a bus, and we need lower fares outside of the new inner zone.

Welcome to the forum, Danny

I agree with your other post (almost an advert for your site, eh  - and I'm so glad you've already confirmed that you're not a one post wonder) that First are taking some positive steps with fares, and I've noticed some other encouraging developments too - but you're right to point out that much more could be done.   I'm not completely understanding what parts of "need to do" are their responsibility, and which are the responsibility of others, nor am I totally familiar with what is sensible for them to do commercially within the system, and what's impractical.   Perhaps you would like to add comment on the thread at
http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=12612.msg142143 which is discussing these issues?

[BristolBusDanny]

Thanks for the welcome grahame! Things like smart cards are needed across the board on all buses by all bus operators, and First has promised to introduce them by next summer. They have promised them before though, and nothing happened so we need to hold them to account!
Other bus companies manage to provide vehicles with lowering floors for disabled bus users, but First gets away with using some 15 year old buses on some routes and they only have steps. They do have until 2015 I think to change this, because in the 21st century lack of disabled access should not be acceptable!
I don't understand why First can't publish fare prices on their website as they are the dominate provider and face no competition on most routes.

[IndustryInsider]

I don't understand why First can't publish fare prices on their website as they are the dominate provider and face no competition on most routes.

I don't think it's restricted to First buses.  I've often given up trying to find bus fares online.  A recent journey from Richmond to Darlington, operated by Arriva, led me to turn up with a pocket full of change as I could find no information online - for what turned out to be a very reasonable fare and a very reasonable service!

[Rhydgaled]

Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services)-style smart cards? I take it you mean functionality (put money on the card in advance which is deducted when you travel) as opposed to technology. The system Oyster runs on is, I believe, called Prestige but the government is pushing for the ITSO smartcard specification to be used instead. The Modern Railways magazine has suggested that an ITSO-on-Prestige project is or will be underway to make Prestige compatible with ITSO cards. Something like that anyway.

Most buses will already have ITSO readers installed since Concessionary Travel Passes for the disabled are ITSO smartcards (well, my Welsh one has an ITSO logo on the back anyway). Actually, I do wonder why Concessionary Travel Passes are smart cards since surely waving a non-smart card in the direction of the driver would work, since you don't need money on the card to pay a fare. I suppose it could be that the government doesn't trust bus operators to supply correct passenger numbers for reinbursment, or just an anti-forgery tactic.

[Brucey]

Most buses will already have ITSO readers installed since Concessionary Travel Passes for the disabled are ITSO smartcards (well, my Welsh one has an ITSO logo on the back anyway). Actually, I do wonder why Concessionary Travel Passes are smart cards since surely waving a non-smart card in the direction of the driver would work, since you don't need money on the card to pay a fare. I suppose it could be that the government doesn't trust bus operators to supply correct passenger numbers for reinbursment, or just an anti-forgery tactic.

It also allows cards to be blacklisted easily to prevent fraudulent use, e.g. in the event of a loss or theft.

On the Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) system, a card reported as lost will work for a maximum of 24 hours, as every bus and gateline synchronises with the central Oyster system at least once a day.  Once the card has been "locked" out of use by one reader, it won't work again even if the buses used later haven't yet received the update.

My biggest priority for bus companies is getting the fares online.  I've been to various countries recently and found the fare easily (even if the site isn't in English) before arriving in the country.  You simply couldn't do that in most places in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom).  In Glasgow, First even advertise "exact fare only, no change given" on the bus stop but fail to tell you the fare.  Almost felt like going into a bank and changing my ^5 note into 5p pieces to make up any fare ... but instead I just walked as it seemed like an easier option.  Quite sad really that this has to be the case if you don't have any small change.

[LiskeardRich]

I've found they are ITSO compliant for a variety of reasons including that in the future they will double up as cards for additional services such as library and leisure passes.
Worcestershire have an interesting PDF on their site explaining the ITSO card and its benefits in more detail. I am unable to share the link from my phone though.

[Rhydgaled]

My biggest priority for bus companies is getting the fares online.  I've been to various countries recently and found the fare easily (even if the site isn't in English) before arriving in the country.  You simply couldn't do that in most places in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom).  In Glasgow, First even advertise "exact fare only, no change given" on the bus stop but fail to tell you the fare.  Almost felt like going into a bank and changing my ^5 note into 5p pieces to make up any fare ... but instead I just walked as it seemed like an easier option.  Quite sad really that this has to be the case if you don't have any small change.

That Glasgow suituation sounds absolutely daft. It certainly would be nice if you could find bus fares online, but there isn't a national system like National Rail for buses so it might be hard to implement.

My local operator doesn't detail all fares but the fares for rover tickets (which are often cheaper than a return on the longest journeys) are displayed on it's website.

[GBM]

Other bus companies manage to provide vehicles with lowering floors for disabled bus users, but First gets away with using some 15 year old buses on some routes and they only have steps. They do have until 2015 I think to change this, because in the 21st century lack of disabled access should not be acceptable!

Now there's a thought - a service 300 (open-topper) with open door access & a lowering floor. Time to duck to avoid the flying pigs.
I'm sure although 2015 is a date somewhere, there will still be a loophole to say that perhaps 60% of all their vehicles should be compliant; which leaves 40% for Devon & Cornwall usage.
It is said (in hushed voices) that a now senior manager is reported as saying (when asked by a driver) why such old vehicles are used in the far west "Driving in such restricted and narrow lanes, it would be pointless putting new vehicles down them.  Use the old ones so it matters less when any damage is done.  You will never get new ones down here".
Still doesn't stop there being an 'investigation' when any damage occurs & points awarded (which rarely happened to drivers in a rival company who took the view that accidents will happen).