'Hedge fund manager in ^42,550 train fare dodge' - ongoing discussion

[whole diary]

[ChrisB]

I suspect he had a zone 1 Travelcard.

He would have needed to touch out/in to get through the barriers at Cannon Street.

But just how he managed to avoid on-train checks for 5+ years is beyond me

[paul7575]

I suspect he had a zone 1 Travelcard.

The original story (as in the first post) suggested that he was incurring 'maximum cash fares' for unresolved journeys, which implies he didn't have a travelcard.   

I think it suited the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) and TfL^» (Transport for London - about) not to share the details though...

Paul

[devon_metro]

If you have a travelcard and you're in your zone you don't actually need to touch in to exit through the barriers. I've done it at Waterloo before where to exit the mainline station I used my Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services), thinking it was the entrance to the Underground.

Similarly i've not touched out at my zone 1 station as the barrier which is usually set to exit was in reverse, however was open due to the crowds. No maximum fares for me. Presumably as I had a Z12 travelcard.

[ChrisB]

indeed - but to open barriers you do need to touch your Travelcard-loaded oyster, which wouldn't then throw an alert to any watching barrier staff. Although press comment have said he was 'fined' the maximum fare each trip, I think he had the above Travelcard loaded.

[devon_metro]

Indeed, i'm suprised the TfL^» (Transport for London - about)/Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) fraud department didn't spot it? Then again if there were getting a maximum fare out of him each day...!

[grahame]

Here's a similar example that's just come to court - once again, a very long time to catch him and it ended up being an inspector (and his own guilty feeling?) rather than the Oyster^▸ (Smartcard system used by passengers on Transport for London services) system seeing a pattern

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3006866/Lawyer-faces-jail-scam-avoid-23-000-rail-fares.html

Dr Peter Barnett gave himself up after being caught by a ticket inspector
Cheated the system travelling from home to London^s Marylebone station
The Australian-born lawyer was cautioned for an identical offence in 2010
He pleaded guilty to six counts of fraud by false representation, which carries maximum penalty of ten years in jail

[ChrisB]

Looks like one less commuter from Haddenham & Thame Parkway.

[TaplowGreen]

Looks like one less commuter from Haddenham & Thame Parkway.

Sheer greed from one of those who could easily afford the fares............however you have to ask how he managed to get away with for so long, how many others are doing similar, and what is really being done to stop it?

Then again if he gets a lengthy stretch it may well prove a deterrent, and a cause a sudden spike in season ticket purchases!!!

[ChrisB]

I see & report pax coming off Mainline trains at least once a week, and draw attention to them if staff are nearby. Chiltern do know it goes on, I suspect others are cauht & don't get the publicity he did

[thetrout]

Thing that gets my back up is if someone with little finance in the bank was caught doing this and couldn't provide a "lump sum" settlement to the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company)... They'd get sent to Prison and the debt probably written off.

But for those who have large sums of money they can pay the TOC off and hope that's the end of the matter. Yet these are the ones who can afford the fares. These are the ones in respected high ranking positions and seem to be able to get away with it.

Whilst I am not for a moment suggesting anyone should get off lightly for what is clear, premeditated fare avoidance... It does very much seem one rule for some and one rule for another...

As for the level of fare dodging. I think it's underestimated by TOCs actually. The amount of middle aged folk for example that I've seen get on trains, sit in First Class and openly say "We'll move if someone challenges us, which they won't for Didcot Parkway - Swindon" then on seeing staff come out with "Oh I think we're in the wrong car, we'll move, sorry!"

Oh and then the teenagers that hide in between the seat backs... Last time I saw this a Lady reported me to revenue (who were drinking Tea at the other end of the Carriage) for not having a First Class ticket. When challenged I declared "I'm really not the person you're looking for" and typed out a message on my phone for the RPI^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)) to read. He then lost interest me and went to grab an MG11^▸ (Form to take a statement for use in court) and his colleague. He'd been there a while as the train had called 2 stations since I was onboard. Only reason I spotted him was because I dropped my biscuits...

The Lady who 'reported' me made a genuine mistake and to her credit an entirely reasonable one. I had some paperwork on the table which included an expenses claim with a stapled Standard Class ticket from Widnes - Liverpool Lime Street that was just over 4 years old

[LiskeardRich]

I wonder how many other people are doing these maximum fares daily. I bet there is 100s of them out there.

[ChrisB]

Thousands I reckon. I really do, across London. And set to get worse when Crossrail comes in.

But I reckon this guy will se jail, Trout. As he should.

[TaplowGreen]

.....what means other than RPIs^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)) and ticket gates do the TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) have to deter/detect ticket fraud? It would be interesting to know, perhaps as a %, how many journeys take place without the correct fare being paid in this manner however very difficult to quantify I guess.......are there any informed estimates?

[IndustryInsider]

There's this press release from ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) suggesting ^240m a year or 120000 journeys a day.

http://www.atoc.org/media-centre/atoc-press-releases/2013/06/17/240m-cost-of-fare-dodging-on-the-railways-top-10-dodgy-excuses-revealed/

The question is how much should be spent in order to try to put a sizeable dent in that ^240m?  If you were to have a combination of barriers at all stations and revenue staff on all trains then it would cost a lot more than that per year I suspect, so it's about getting the balance right.

[Btline]

Much of the country is now a "free" railway as there are either no guards, or they simply do not bother checking tickets.

Central Trains / London Midland rarely check tickets on the Snow Hill route.
I now live in London, and the DLR^▸ (Docklands Light Railway) is effectively a free railway for the dishonest - I see it daily.

Same with South Eastern trains - I mean the Stonegate passenger had a journey of well over an hour - the fact that there were no checks in 5 years is a disgrace.

Chiltern should learn - if the commuter had bought a Wembley to London season ticket, he would have not been caught! Just having barriers at London will not stop evaders...