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chrisr_75
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« on: May 13, 2015, 16:50:19 » |
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Having seen a TM‡ on East Midlands Trains refuse a parent/carer a bottle of water, (which she offered to pay for) as she couldn't leave her seat because of the high support needing child she was with. Whilst I was in the Buffet I asked for a complimentary bottle of water which was given without fuss. As I walked back to First Class I put the bottle of water on the table as I passed and just kept walking.
P.S. 10/10 for this, I'm sure she appreciated that gesture! |
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ChrisB
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« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2015, 18:28:54 » |
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But why wasn't the parent equipped with sufficient water?
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chrisr_75
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« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2015, 23:14:35 » |
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But why wasn't the parent equipped with sufficient water?
You got me there, but the lady did apparently ask the TM‡ for assistance who flat refused and it was a kind gesture from Mr Trout nonetheless, which was my main point! Anyhow, water is always available to all on planes & most trains for free or to purchase so it's not unreasonable to expect to be able to purchase a bottle on the train/plane, but getting to the buffet car was the issue in this instance. |
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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2015, 23:32:43 » |
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... the lady did apparently ask the TM‡ for assistance who flat refused and it was a kind gesture from Mr Trout nonetheless, which was my main point!
Anyhow, water is always available to all on planes & most trains for free or to purchase so it's not unreasonable to expect to be able to purchase a bottle on the train/plane, but getting to the buffet car was the issue in this instance.
I agree, chrisr_75. Simply handing out a bottle of water in such circumstances surely shouldn't be any problem? After all, in times of delay ( which I understand do happen from time to time on the railways!) the on-train staff are encouraged - even instructed - to issue complimentary bottles of water to any passengers who require them.  |
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William Huskisson MP▸ was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830. Many more have died in the same way since then. Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.
"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner." Discuss.
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ChrisB
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« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2015, 23:35:45 » |
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The mother would have known that she would have been unable to leave her child/seat, sorry. That child hadn't just developed the illness. My point stands, think ahead & take responsibility
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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2015, 23:48:37 » |
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In the interests of clarity, I've split these posts off into this separate topic, as they all relate to a specific incident which was mentioned, in passing, elsewhere.  |
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William Huskisson MP▸ was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830. Many more have died in the same way since then. Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.
"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner." Discuss.
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Tim
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« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2015, 09:53:43 » |
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The mother would have known that she would have been unable to leave her child/seat, sorry. That child hadn't just developed the illness. My point stands, think ahead & take responsibility
With respect, I think you are conflating two issues here. Yes the mother SHOULD have taken responsibility and carried water. BUT, given that she didn't have any water - perhaps she simply made a mistake - no one is perfect, the TM‡ should have helped. |
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2015, 10:43:30 » |
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The mother would have known that she would have been unable to leave her child/seat, sorry. That child hadn't just developed the illness. My point stands, think ahead & take responsibility
Chris - have you ever found yourself in a situation where you, or someone you are with have needed help/assistance? are you inevitably perfectly prepared for every eventuality? Or do you simply never leave your house (just in case)? I too was once a Boy Scout and was taught "Be prepared", but sometimes life just ain't like that buddy, and people need to be flexible to allow for the type of human error/frailties which it would appear (judging from your comments here and elsewhere on similar subjects) you, uniquely, are fortunate enough never to suffer from. |
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Phil
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« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2015, 11:43:05 » |
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About 4 years ago, when still in full time work, I attended a technical training course. On the final day, the lecturer rushed in around 5 minutes late for the start, obviously very flustered. His explanation? He'd got himself into a flap over whether he'd packed everything he needed in his survival kit in the car when he left home. This went WAY beyond the usual orange warning triangle many of us carry in the boot of our cars, and included cold water, hot water (a flask), dried and tinned food, gas cooker, space blankets, sleeping bag, snowshoes, a snow spade, etc etc.
I have to say, he had seemed a little bit eccentric over the previous two days, but nothing had prepared us for this. Apparently he had a long, long list he had to check off before leaving his house. If there had been severe weather warnings the night before it would I suppose have been just about understandable (although a little extreme even then), but this was in August, and he was only commuting from Wokingham to Chippenham.
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broadgage
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« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2015, 13:41:04 » |
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In the case of the mother or carer needing water, then I agree that they should have planned ahead and taken sufficient water with them. What would they have done if the buffet had been closed, or run out of water ?
However accepting that people make mistakes and might forget to take any/enough water, then I feel that the train manger should have helped in this case.
I certainly take reasonable precautions to ensure my comfort and safety when travelling by rail, but there are limits as to what is sensible.
In warm weather I always take water or soft drinks, in cold weather I don't bother as I am satisfied that I can survive without for 12 hours with only mild discomfort.
In severe winter weather I go so far as to take a blanket, but only in severe weather, very OTT▸ under normal conditions.
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A proper intercity train has a minimum of 8 coaches, gangwayed throughout, with first at one end, and a full sized buffet car between first and standard.
It has space for cycles, surfboards,luggage etc.
A 5 car DMU▸ is not a proper inter-city train. The 5+5 and 9 car DMUs are almost as bad.
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thetrout
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« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2015, 19:28:53 » |
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Woah, didn't expect this to go off like it has. I really need to leave those cans of worms alone  I am in partial agreement regarding the water. However I overheard most of the conversation and the TM‡ had received multiple complaints from passengers regarding the child in question, who was visibly and very clearly distressed. Autism and/or a mental health condition was quite obvious. So in a sense I really cannot condemn the child. Having both ASD and Mental Health Conditions it would be hypocritical for me to do so. I think the TMs lack of help was rather draconian as it was clear he had the power to do something and merely wanted to give the carer/parent a serious b*ll*cking for "noise" complaints. I was sat in the composite carriage and although the child was being noisy, they were by far nowhere near as loud as a screaming baby for hours on end. Of course hindsight is an absolutely wonderful thing... But we are all human and we all find ourselves in situations that are less than ideal. It's all very well and good a third party saying "You should have done this" "You are at fault for that" - But it doesn't actually help the persons involved. We all make mistakes and provided we learn from them we should move on and put it down to experience. That being said, even the most well thought through plans can go pear-shaped on you. I have backup plans for long distance travel usually. However to plan for 3 trains breaking down and a Signal Failure on the same day? Seems a little over the top right? I've experienced just that... And it took me FOREVER to get to Newcastle - My colleagues had driven nearly 150 miles in a minibus; in that same amount of time I was still in Newcastle First Class Lounge watching trains getting later/cancelled left right and centre!  |
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LiskeardRich
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« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2015, 19:43:12 » |
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The posts asking why she didn't have water.
What about from the other side.
Had she been delayed and run out of her packed water supply?
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All posts are my own personal believes, opinions and understandings!
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ChrisB
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« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2015, 20:56:16 » |
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There are many possible hypotheticals.
In these instances, you can only discuss the info provided, otherwise all manner of options come into play
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