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John R
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« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2016, 00:25:08 » |
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Going back to the guards' dispute, what I'm not clear on is what happens in mid August when Govia impose the change to DOO▸ . I've not heard anything to the effect that ASLEF» are looking to prevent it, maybe because so many services are already DOO on Southern that contractually they don't have a leg to stand on. If that's the case, does that clear up at a stroke the current problems because an unavailable second member of crew is no longer an issue?
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2016, 14:10:53 » |
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GTR also decreed that self certification is null and void, so even 1 day sickness means needing a fit note, which then means a wait to see the GP, who are also in dispute with the government...
A GP will not (normally) issue a sick note until day 7. As for getting an appointment, my wife called for an appointment last week, the earliest available appointment for non emergencys....2nd August! I do remember working for a company years ago who would ask for med certs from day 1 if the person concerned was felt to be swinging the lead (ie large numbers of single day absences on Mondays and/or Fridays), and proper sickness absence procedures had been followed to ascertain if there was any underlying reason.It did cause problems with GPs refusing to issue them, so the person concerned either had to ask the GP to issue a private med cert or see a private GP...........strangely enough the individuals sickness records seem to improve quite suddenly. |
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LiskeardRich
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« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2016, 14:29:53 » |
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GTR also decreed that self certification is null and void, so even 1 day sickness means needing a fit note, which then means a wait to see the GP, who are also in dispute with the government...
A GP will not (normally) issue a sick note until day 7. As for getting an appointment, my wife called for an appointment last week, the earliest available appointment for non emergencys....2nd August! I do remember working for a company years ago who would ask for med certs from day 1 if the person concerned was felt to be swinging the lead (ie large numbers of single day absences on Mondays and/or Fridays), and proper sickness absence procedures had been followed to ascertain if there was any underlying reason.It did cause problems with GPs refusing to issue them, so the person concerned either had to ask the GP to issue a private med cert or see a private GP...........strangely enough the individuals sickness records seem to improve quite suddenly. The company I have recently left allowed x periods of sickness in y months. A period of sickness was defined as consecutive working days absenses. so sick on Monday came in on Tuesday, realised you weren't better and took Wednesday off that was 2 periods of sickness, however taking the whole week off without returning was 1 period. If taken more than x periods of sickness in the y months, you lost your bonus for the next bonus period. |
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All posts are my own personal believes, opinions and understandings!
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2016, 14:45:51 » |
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GTR also decreed that self certification is null and void, so even 1 day sickness means needing a fit note, which then means a wait to see the GP, who are also in dispute with the government...
A GP will not (normally) issue a sick note until day 7. As for getting an appointment, my wife called for an appointment last week, the earliest available appointment for non emergencys....2nd August! I do remember working for a company years ago who would ask for med certs from day 1 if the person concerned was felt to be swinging the lead (ie large numbers of single day absences on Mondays and/or Fridays), and proper sickness absence procedures had been followed to ascertain if there was any underlying reason.It did cause problems with GPs refusing to issue them, so the person concerned either had to ask the GP to issue a private med cert or see a private GP...........strangely enough the individuals sickness records seem to improve quite suddenly. The company I have recently left allowed x periods of sickness in y months. A period of sickness was defined as consecutive working days absenses. so sick on Monday came in on Tuesday, realised you weren't better and took Wednesday off that was 2 periods of sickness, however taking the whole week off without returning was 1 period. If taken more than x periods of sickness in the y months, you lost your bonus for the next bonus period. Things have changed a lot over the years...........I always remember my first "proper" job in a highly unionised public sector environment about 30 years ago where you were "allowed" 20 days sick per calendar year before any action was even considered (yes, really, 20 days!)..........the number of people who had between 15-19 days off sick per year was amazing, it was really considered to be an additional period of annual leave, you would hear guys saying "I've only got a weeks leave left but I've got two weeks sick too"! Conversely if you DIDN'T take "enough" sick leave and were perceived not to be playing the game, you could expect a visit from the Union Convener suggesting a week long illness may be prudent to keep the averages up!!! |
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LiskeardRich
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« Reply #19 on: July 11, 2016, 15:58:24 » |
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GTR also decreed that self certification is null and void, so even 1 day sickness means needing a fit note, which then means a wait to see the GP, who are also in dispute with the government...
A GP will not (normally) issue a sick note until day 7. As for getting an appointment, my wife called for an appointment last week, the earliest available appointment for non emergencys....2nd August! I do remember working for a company years ago who would ask for med certs from day 1 if the person concerned was felt to be swinging the lead (ie large numbers of single day absences on Mondays and/or Fridays), and proper sickness absence procedures had been followed to ascertain if there was any underlying reason.It did cause problems with GPs refusing to issue them, so the person concerned either had to ask the GP to issue a private med cert or see a private GP...........strangely enough the individuals sickness records seem to improve quite suddenly. The company I have recently left allowed x periods of sickness in y months. A period of sickness was defined as consecutive working days absenses. so sick on Monday came in on Tuesday, realised you weren't better and took Wednesday off that was 2 periods of sickness, however taking the whole week off without returning was 1 period. If taken more than x periods of sickness in the y months, you lost your bonus for the next bonus period. Things have changed a lot over the years...........I always remember my first "proper" job in a highly unionised public sector environment about 30 years ago where you were "allowed" 20 days sick per calendar year before any action was even considered (yes, really, 20 days!)..........the number of people who had between 15-19 days off sick per year was amazing, it was really considered to be an additional period of annual leave, you would hear guys saying "I've only got a weeks leave left but I've got two weeks sick too"! Conversely if you DIDN'T take "enough" sick leave and were perceived not to be playing the game, you could expect a visit from the Union Convener suggesting a week long illness may be prudent to keep the averages up!!! I actually exceeded 20 days sickness due to reoccurring tonsillitis which is now gone forever, but they only took over 2-3 periods of sickness which was acceptable! If I had 20 individual days I think I would have been long managed out of the business! |
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All posts are my own personal believes, opinions and understandings!
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2016, 16:08:26 » |
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The company I have recently left allowed x periods of sickness in y months. A period of sickness was defined as consecutive working days absenses. so sick on Monday came in on Tuesday, realised you weren't better and took Wednesday off that was 2 periods of sickness, however taking the whole week off without returning was 1 period.
If taken more than x periods of sickness in the y months, you lost your bonus for the next bonus period.
The railway does have a similar measure, agreed with the unions, called Managing For Attendance. You trigger stage one if you have a certain number of days off sick, or singular instances of sickness. If you have no medical reason and continue to take sick leave you go on to stage two and so on until the final stage, which is dismissal. It's fairly easy to trigger stage one but not let it get serious enough to get to stage two, and any employee, especially with union backing, finds it gets harder and harder to just dismiss someone for anything other than gross negligence. |
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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paul7575
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« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2016, 16:27:43 » |
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There's a reasonably dispassionate article about GTR's issues on the London Reconnections site. They highlight the following issues: Driver Shortage Rolling Stock issues London Bridge Ongoing Signalling Issues Reactionary delay Dwell time Guards dispute ...and then they go on to try and explain some of the background reasons: http://www.londonreconnections.com/2016/railway-roulette/Paul |
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NickB
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« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2016, 08:37:03 » |
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On the news last night (10pm ITV?) an interesting question was raised and I am curious as to the views of the forum...
In light of Southern's apparent ability to remove 350 trains from their timetable, causing further overcrowding and cancelling all week day trains from some stations in their entirety, apparently without consequence to franchise nor suitable compensation arrangements to passengers, does this set a dangerous precedent for other operators to pare down their service?
I ask this in light of GWR▸ 's apparent avoidance of declaring a void day following the complete suspension of Paddington services after the June derailment, simply by amending the timetable (read: slashing services).
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LiskeardRich
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« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2016, 10:47:11 » |
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Nick I believe it is acceptable providing a certain notice period is given.
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All posts are my own personal believes, opinions and understandings!
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2016, 11:01:49 » |
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It's a different scenario in that GTR, who run Southern, give fare income straight to the DfT» and are paid a management fee to operate the service. Therefore their relationship with the DfT is very different - you could argue that it is the DfT that has allowed their service to become so frail at the moment. The reason for the franchise model was because of the complications caused by the huge amount of work going on to improve the Thameslink network. There does also need to be some mechanism for TOC▸ 's to be able to change their timetable without penalty for things like engineering work which they don't cause themselves. However, I agree completely that short notice changes to widespread problems that a TOC did cause themselves, such as ploughing one of their trains into an overhead stanchion, should be penalised in some way, with the 'void day' mechanism being the most sensible one that could be enforced. Delay/Repay, when introduced, should ensure that delays are accepted with the normal timetable as the basis for claims - the Southern website states "Please note that whilst the amended timetable is in place then claims will be accepted against either the amended timetable or the normal timetable." which isn't as clear as I would like, but appears to say that if you turn up for a train in the normal timetable and your journey is delayed by more than 30/60 minutes you can claim 50%/100% of the cost of that journey. If that's the case, then I think that is a fair way of providing compensation for longer term disruption. P.S. Can anyone spot the slight 'error' currently on the Wikipedia entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Govia_Thameslink_Railway |
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #25 on: July 13, 2016, 11:42:13 » |
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William Huskisson MP▸ was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830. Many more have died in the same way since then. Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.
"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner." Discuss.
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patch38
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« Reply #26 on: July 13, 2016, 11:47:43 » |
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That's funny. I wonder how long it has been like that? Aren't modern, media-savvy companies supposed to have people who keep an eye on injudicious edits of Wikipedia and suchlike? |
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TeaStew
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« Reply #27 on: July 13, 2016, 12:20:32 » |
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That's funny. I wonder how long it has been like that? Aren't modern, media-savvy companies supposed to have people who keep an eye on injudicious edits of Wikipedia and suchlike? Since 05.11 this morning (13th July) so not too long! |
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #28 on: July 13, 2016, 13:05:11 » |
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Now gone...
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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Chris from Nailsea
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« Reply #29 on: July 13, 2016, 13:42:41 » |
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... but not lost forever: I took a copy, purely for the record.    The wording of that page on wikipedia, this morning: Govia Thameslink Railway (GTR) is a train operating company and torture device that operates the Thameslink, Southern and Great Northern (TSGN) rail franchise. Within the franchise, GTR runs the Thameslink, Great Northern, Southern and Gatwick Express airport services.
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« Last Edit: July 13, 2016, 20:16:48 by Chris from Nailsea »
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William Huskisson MP▸ was the first person to be killed by a train while crossing the tracks, in 1830. Many more have died in the same way since then. Don't take a chance: stop, look, listen.
"Level crossings are safe, unless they are used in an unsafe manner." Discuss.
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