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CJB666
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« Reply #15 on: September 04, 2018, 16:02:02 » |
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I may have missed or forgotten one, but the incidents I can recall where an arm or similar-sized object was not detected were on mainline trains. More specifically, the Bushey one (see above) which was on a Class 350, Newcastle in 2014 (Class 185), Hayes & Harlington in 2015 (Class 165) and Kings Cross in 2011 (Class 365). The first two of those use "sensitive edges" which can be bent out of the door plane and so not detect an arm. The last two were working to the current standard (GM/RT2473) or the previous BR▸ one (GO/OTS 300) which required detection of anything 25m across - not good enough to detect fingers or small hands.
And at Hounslow East there was an old lady who was dragged the length of the platform with her coat caught in the door. Over the years I have witnessed many attempts to 'harm' pax by TfL» drivers on the Tube. On the Northern Line a few years ago the doors closed the doors on a pushchair with a kid inside. This bent the pushchair and nearly squashed the kid. The driver released the doors. The parents pulled the pushchair back onto the platform. The driver then closed the doors and sped off. Many Tube drivers have an appalling attitude towards passenger safety. |
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« Last Edit: September 04, 2018, 20:21:14 by CJB666 »
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Timmer
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« Reply #16 on: September 04, 2018, 17:07:26 » |
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Over the years I have witnessed many attempts at murder of pax by TfL» drivers on the Tube.
I think to use the word murder is a bit strong there CJB666. Murder is always with the intention to kill someone. To say that TfL tube drivers have attempted to murder passengers is a somewhat baseless accusation. |
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TaplowGreen
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« Reply #17 on: September 04, 2018, 17:10:06 » |
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Mind the gap
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stuving
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« Reply #18 on: September 04, 2018, 19:52:37 » |
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The RAIB▸ only looked back to 2008 for previous events, and in part that's because they have only existed, and produced reports with recommendations in the present format, since 2005/6. But there is also the point that the trains, and in particular their safety systems and operating methods, have changed enough to make earlier events less relevant.
For example, that Hounslow East one was in 1993, and not only was it fatal but it was the first of three serious accidents. The next one was an elderly man dragged by his stick, and finally in 1997 at Holborn an 11-year old boy was dragged by his jacket into a tunnel and killed. Now, just before 1993 all the passenger emergency handles had been disconnected from the brakes, making them into alarms to the driver alone. After 1997, they were all changed again so they do stop the train if part of it is still in the station, but after that the driver can override it. The idea is that no-one is likely to survive being dragged in the tunnel once the train is up to speed. No doubt one could argue about that, but in this NHG case the train was already stopping before the victim got that far.
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CJB666
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« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2018, 18:00:26 » |
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Yet again a 'drag and kill' ... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6154595/Disabled-passengers-Shih-Tzu-dog-died-lead-got-caught-trains-doors.htmlDisabled passenger's Shih Tzu dog Jonty died after his lead got caught in a train's doors dragging him along the platform and into a tunnel * Retired nurse Rose Barry boarded a train in Borehamwood, Hertfordshire, Friday * She claims the doors closed which she was loading her luggage on to the coach * Her Shih Tzu Jonty was dragged along the platform and killed as the doors shut * Devastated Ms Barry is now demanding more help for disabled passengers |
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martyjon
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« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2018, 18:47:47 » |
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Yet again a 'drag and kill' ... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6154595/Disabled-passengers-Shih-Tzu-dog-died-lead-got-caught-trains-doors.htmlDisabled passenger's Shih Tzu dog Jonty died after his lead got caught in a train's doors dragging him along the platform and into a tunnel * Retired nurse Rose Barry boarded a train in Borehamwood, Hertfordshire, Friday * She claims the doors closed which she was loading her luggage on to the coach * Her Shih Tzu Jonty was dragged along the platform and killed as the doors shut * Devastated Ms Barry is now demanding more help for disabled passengers Was it on a DOO▸ service which I suspect it was then bully for the unions for demanding a second person on board. |
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ChrisB
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« Reply #21 on: September 11, 2018, 20:18:16 » |
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Did she help herself by booking assustance?
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JayMac
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« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2018, 16:22:36 » |
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There should be CCTV▸ coverage for the entire passenger/train interface. Covering every door.
Whether a shih tzu would have seen is another matter...
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« Last Edit: September 12, 2018, 17:42:34 by bignosemac »
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"Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for the rest of the day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
- Sir Terry Pratchett.
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paul7575
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« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2018, 17:27:55 » |
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There should be CCTV▸ coverage for the entire passenger/train interface. Covering every door.
Thameslink 700s use bodyside cameras like 387s, shouldn’t really be issues with bends in the track. With a central driving position the driver won’t be looking back out the window either. Paul |
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IndustryInsider
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« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2018, 17:37:10 » |
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The bodyside cameras are an improvement on traditional platform mounted CCTV▸ monitors, provided the image transmitted is of sufficient quality. Still, it's not easy for one person to monitor twenty-four sets of doors on a train with hundreds of people milling about on the platform, and I guess you could argue the number of incidents is pretty low given the tens of thousands of times per day trains are dispatched this way.
Speaking of image quality, I was quite surprised just how bad the image quality is when sitting in the cab of a DOO▸ train - the IET▸ 's ones are quite jerky and often blurred due to not being used much at the moment and therefore not cleaned regularly.
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To view my GWML▸ Electrification cab video 'before and after' video comparison, as well as other videos of the new layout at Reading and 'before and after' comparisons of the Cotswold Line Redoubling scheme, see: http://www.dailymotion.com/user/IndustryInsider/ |
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1st fan
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« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2018, 19:38:20 » |
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I don't think a lift would move with an arm or foot in the door but, according to Chris B, a tube train will.
But ChrisB was talking about "these events", which I take to be not only tube trains. I was on the tube last night and the driver made an announcement specifically for one passenger. He gave this woman a right telling off for boarding as the doors were closing. She had caught her large-ish bag in the doors and caused him to open them again. Telling her how dangerous it was how it held up everyone from getting home etc. After a minute or so of lambasting her stupidity we moved off. |
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ChrisB
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« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2018, 10:19:08 » |
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Did she help herself by booking assistance?
It was at Boreham Wood. The train was a 12 car Thameslink. The station was unstaffed. The initial report stated that she went back to the station building to find two staff there, uninterested. It is not unmanned. I think it has ticket barriers too. She didn't book assistance & never has it appears. |
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martyjon
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« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2018, 10:57:22 » |
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Many older folk still like to enjoy their independence and are too proud to ask for assistance except in the extreme.
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ChrisB
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« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2018, 11:30:58 » |
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Indeed....they need to learn that it often helps.
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