Is it April 1st ??

[whole diary]

[Clan Line]

According to the Daily Telegraph today, Go Ahead and Angel Trains are studying plans to reduce the number of seats in their trains so that more people can stand up. 

Katy Taylor, Head of Strategy at Go Ahead, is reported as saying "I often stand on the train because you’ve been sitting in the office all day and it’s quite nice to stand" .............peoples' journey habits are going to change, but crises are the opportunity to change things,..........we are going to have work hard to get customers to come back to public transport…..............we need to do everything we can to make it more compelling for them"


The costs of converting existing rolling stock is estimated to be £50 - 150K per coach, this would "save millions" as new "standing" cattle trucks coaches would be £1.5M - 2.5M each.

Well, I am sure these proposals will have people flocking back to the trains !!

[Lee]

Yes, I am sure this is exactly what the authors of the White Paper had in mind as we head into the glorious Great British Railways era of comfy seating for all 

[ellendune]

Well it would solve the issue with the cushions being too hard.   

[grahame]

Yes, I am sure this is exactly what the authors of the White Paper had in mind as we head into the glorious Great British Railways era of comfy seating for all 

No ... it's "removing the seats that people find uncomfortable" - a positive step

[Witham Bobby]

Yes, I am sure this is exactly what the authors of the White Paper had in mind as we head into the glorious Great British Railways era of comfy seating for all 

No ... it's "removing the seats that people find uncomfortable" - a positive step

When you're having a day that seems to have entered a Monty Python sketch

[Trowres]

You can interpret this quote from Williams/Shapps in more than one way:

Great British Railways will bring forward the normal replacement cycles on existing trains equipped with "ironing-board"-like seats, beginning with long-distance trains, in order to make the seats signifcantly more comfortable, or to replace and eventually remove them altogether

[stuving]

I'm not convinced anyone will want to know what was really behind this, before it turned into an excuse for jokes. However, here goes anyway. The same story has now surfaced on Rail Professional:

The post-COVID railway carriage: Go-Ahead and Angel Trains plan flexible spaces for commuter and leisure travellers

    New concepts allow seating and luggage space to be adjusted according to demand
    Additional laptop space to meet “work from anywhere” expectations
    Dedicated space in each carriage for fold-up and full-size bicycles
    Designs are concepts for the future created by Go-Ahead and Angel Trains

Carriages that can be adjusted from ‘commuter mode’ to ‘leisure mode’ are among the concepts for the future being considered by The Go-Ahead Group, Britain’s largest rail operator, as the industry prepares for a return of passengers to the network.

Working in partnership with the rolling stock company Angel Trains, Go-Ahead today releases early blueprints for train carriages that feature flexible zones to accommodate an increased provision for passenger bicycles or luggage...

The article has more pictures that timeshare. The underlying mindset appears to be that so few passengers will come back to peak services that there will be lots of unused seats that can be taken out, and replaced with a variety of other things, in a desperate attempt to entice a few more to travel. This time there's nothing about standing - just this:

In some carriages, perch seats and benches could be created offering extra space for passengers to plug in and work on electronic devices, reflecting an increasing expectation that it should be possible to work or stay connected anywhere.

Presumably that promoted a question such as "will anyone want to perch - basically stand - for a whole journey?". The answer to that can then be quoted without the question - it's an old (journalists') trick bit evidently it still works.

Some buses and (I think) trains do already have perches, but I wonder if they really do intend them to be for laptop users. If so I'd have asked how you'd manage to hold on, and hold their laptop in place, while using it - it does sound like the idea of someone who doesn't spend much time on moving trains!

By the way this Katy Taylor is now working her notice at Go Ahead. and will start at Southern Water in August in a similar role.

[ChrisB]

Those tables will need to be at least big enough for two laptops, otherwise there will be perpetual bun fights!

[Surrey 455]

Normally, you'd remove seats to increase capacity. You can fit more standing passengers than seated ones. TfL^» (Transport for London - about) are the masters of this.

Perhaps we could start by ripping out the 3+2 seating on some trains and replace with 2+2 with a gap between each seat of say 4-5cm.

[stuving]

I see they have called these "concepts for the future". So they are just thinking aloud (i.e. in public), or even playing at being college students doing a design project. I can't see why they would urgently need to do anything that meant spending money - if it's going to be their decision anyway, which it probably isn't.

[ChrisB]

The DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) using them simply to do their dirty work & test public reaction before introducing said olicy. We all know the DfT drill by now

[Clan Line]

By the way this Katy Taylor is now working her notice at Go Ahead. and will start at Southern Water in August in a similar role.

"in a similar role"..................................I'm panic buying vast quantities of bottled water before then !!

[broadgage]

By the way this Katy Taylor is now working her notice at Go Ahead. and will start at Southern Water in August in a similar role.

"in a similar role"..................................I'm panic buying vast quantities of bottled water before then !!

And an IBC to fill with water..
And a few thousand water chlorination tablets, each to treat one liter, and a few dozen each to treat 20 liters.
And some plastic jerry cans.
And a slow gravity microfilter, and some spare filters.

https://evaq8.co.uk/Water-Purification/

And also
https://www.waterfilterman.co.uk/doulton-water-filters/649-doulton-gravity-water-filter-system-with-super-sterasyl-candles-w9361122-0804066831413.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwna2FBhDPARIsACAEc_Vl85DK0HHLq-Uo47QzW2H1CdSl-9bTGzyz-FvBXJPhZKN8rAuSw2IaAlcLEALw_wcB

[grahame]

Joking aside (if I'm going to be able to do that in this thread!), there is a lot to be said for dynamic passenger accommodation that can change to meet requirements.   Nothing new - it's been around since early tram days where the seat backs pivoted over so that everyone could face the direction of travel.    How you achieve it simply (reversible within turn around time at the end of a journey) so that you have [mobile-office/standing-space/cycle-racks/sleepers/restaurant] is something I'll leave to the clever technical people.

[stuving]

Moving even further from joking - to Belfort, to be precise - SNCF^▸ (Societe Nationale des Chemins de fer Francais - French National Railways) Voyageurs and Alstom unveiled their next-gen TGV^▸ (Train a Grande Vitesse) (actually only a power car, the rest was still inside a computer:

A new face for a new train

This eco-designed TGV, the first trainsets of which are scheduled to enter service in 2024, has benefited from the know-how of the best experts from Voyages SNCF and Alstom, brought together on a common platform during the definition and co-specification phases of the project. This new way of designing a more innovative and efficient train is a first in Europe.

Thanks to a more compact, simplified, and streamlined architecture, the TGV M boasts reduced acquisition and maintenance costs whilst gaining 20% in capacity.

The return of energy to the catenary during braking, eco-driving and the increasingly aerodynamic shape of the nose allow overall energy savings of around 20%.
4th generation TGV features

These new vehicles, which will also contribute to our OUIGO offer, introduce a number of major advancements:

• unprecedented modularity, making it possible to adjust the number of carriages according to precise market needs (7, 8, or 9), to transform 1st class seating areas into 2nd class areas and reconfigure them by adding or removing seats or bicycle and baggage storage areas, etc.
• on-board floor space increased by 20%, amounting to 740 seats compared to 600 in current duplex carriages.
• ultra-competitive energy efficiency and carbon footprint per journey: with a 97% carbon recyclability objective, the TGV M's carbon footprint is the lowest on the market.
• access to online scalable services to meet passenger needs, such as on-board WiFi and complete real-time information across train areas.
• real-time provision of information on train parts, allowing preventive maintenance.
• 100% accessibility across carriage areas for all passengers. From the start, TGV M was the first TGV to be designed in close collaboration with wheelchair user (WU) associations and will be the first TGV to provide fully autonomous train accessibility for people with reduced mobility.

So there you go - modularity (and modulability) are evidently the thing these days.

You might quibble about some things ... like whether that nose really is aerodynamic, and as to pretty! Or the "unprecedented" status of being able to adjust the number of carriages according to precise market needs.