Bicycles on trains (merged topics)

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

I would be interested to see what percentage of delay minutes on our rail network are actually caused by cyclists.

I'm pretty sure it would be small in the grand scheme of things, but disproportionately large considering the number of delays that are due to passengers and the number of those that are travelling with bikes.

[Mookiemoo]

Storage would have to be pretty damn secure to even entice me to leave my bicycle at a station again!

My first one I left at Paddington - chained to the hilt, buried in the middle of the bike racks until one monday I came back to find it missing - both wheels, handlebars, seat - in fact the only thing left was a frame!

Never again.

[matt473]

Instead of providing bike spaces on trains, there should be more schemes such as the one in Bristol where you can use a bike that is already situated at the station for people to use. This is more beneficial than allowing bikes on the trains whilst you are safe in the knowledge that a bike is waiting for you when you get off the train. If I remember rightly, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are partners in this cheme so hopefull could trial it in other areas soon. This is a better idea than having bikes taking up valuable space in a train.

[bemmy]

I would be interested to see what percentage of delay minutes on our rail network are actually caused by cyclists.

I'm pretty sure it would be small in the grand scheme of things, but disproportionately large considering the number of delays that are due to passengers and the number of those that are travelling with bikes.

Yes I was one of those bad cyclists who delayed a train once. I was arguing with the guard, insisting that he let me put my bike on the train, on the grounds that I had a valid reservation which I had showed him, while he said he couldn't because he hadn't been told about my reservation and there were parcels in the bike section. After a few minutes he let me on and we left 3 or 4 minutes late. Clearly some of the people on the train saw the argument as I got a fair few dirty looks as I walked down the carriage -- being a cyclist I was obviously in the wrong. After a few experiences like that I got the message that we're more trouble than we're worth and haven't taken my bike on a train in over 10 years.

Storage would have to be pretty damn secure to even entice me to leave my bicycle at a station again!

My first one I left at Paddington - chained to the hilt, buried in the middle of the bike racks until one monday I came back to find it missing - both wheels, handlebars, seat - in fact the only thing left was a frame!

Never again.

Having had two bikes stolen from in front of the so-called police station on Platform 4 at Temple Meads, I don't leave my bike at train stations any more either.

[bemmy]

Instead of providing bike spaces on trains, there should be more schemes such as the one in Bristol where you can use a bike that is already situated at the station for people to use. This is more beneficial than allowing bikes on the trains whilst you are safe in the knowledge that a bike is waiting for you when you get off the train. If I remember rightly, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are partners in this cheme so hopefull could trial it in other areas soon. This is a better idea than having bikes taking up valuable space in a train.

I like this idea. I'd definitely use this scheme if there was a reasonably priced bike available for hire at my destination, and they could also start charging a hefty fee for bike reservations on trains, to encourage people to hire them instead.

[Mookiemoo]

Instead of providing bike spaces on trains, there should be more schemes such as the one in Bristol where you can use a bike that is already situated at the station for people to use. This is more beneficial than allowing bikes on the trains whilst you are safe in the knowledge that a bike is waiting for you when you get off the train. If I remember rightly, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are partners in this cheme so hopefull could trial it in other areas soon. This is a better idea than having bikes taking up valuable space in a train.

I like this idea. I'd definitely use this scheme if there was a reasonably priced bike available for hire at my destination, and they could also start charging a hefty fee for bike reservations on trains, to encourage people to hire them instead.

And as long as the bikes for hire were of reasonable quality - but you know what would happen - in six months they'd be beaten up, trashed and thats if they were decent spec in the first place.

[matt473]

I like this idea. I'd definitely use this scheme if there was a reasonably priced bike available for hire at my destination, and they could also start charging a hefty fee for bike reservations on trains, to encourage people to hire them instead.

I'm not 100% on this but ifI remember rightly the bike is free for the first 30mins and a ^1 for each hour after, but of course there is a registration fee of ^10 for your card enabling you to use the service.

The problem about the quality of the bikes may not be too great as apparently the bikes hold up well against vandalism as this system has been used around Europe for years.

Info available form https://www.hourbike.com/hourbike/home.do

[Chris from Nailsea]

The subject is also covered by the BBC^» (British Broadcasting Corporation - home page), at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/8278320.stm

[Mookiemoo]

I like this idea. I'd definitely use this scheme if there was a reasonably priced bike available for hire at my destination, and they could also start charging a hefty fee for bike reservations on trains, to encourage people to hire them instead.

I'm not 100% on this but ifI remember rightly the bike is free for the first 30mins and a ^1 for each hour after, but of course there is a registration fee of ^10 for your card enabling you to use the service.

The problem about the quality of the bikes may not be too great as apparently the bikes hold up well against vandalism as this system has been used around Europe for years.

Info available form https://www.hourbike.com/hourbike/home.do

21 speed, front and rear discs, front suspension?

Thats the min I'd want

[IndustryInsider]

21 speed, front and rear discs, front suspension?

Thats the min I'd want

If we're talking about commuters mostly cycling through the streets of London then for the majority there would be no need or desire for suspension, disc brakes, or 21 gears on the mostly flat streets. Indeed suspension and disc brakes are not even essential if you are a fairly serious cyclist - I cycled from Llanfairfechan to the base of Snowdon, then up to the summit overnight and back down again at sunrise when I was a keen cyclist myself and managed perfectly well with my trusty Marin MTB, without any of those luxury trimmings. I did however use all of the 21 gears!

In terms of storage, the proposed Paddington facilities would (as I understand it) be a secure boxed compound, which would be staffed, and allow storage in return for a small fee. The dingy facilities currently at Paddington are a criminals haven - so what may have happened in the past would not deter me from trying this new scheme out (if I was commuting myself with a bike). I'd certainly be happy to pay a reasonable fee in return for having no hassles or worries about whether I'd get my bike on the train I wanted each morning, whilst being safe in the knowledge that the storage is secure.

[Tim]

Just my comments...

1, I understand the arguements that bikes take up space that could be used for seats.  I would not therefore be surprised if new trains have few bike spaces.  HOWEVER, HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) already have loads of space in the powercars.  Only carrying 6 bikes whether due to policy, a lack of a big enough rack or whatever, is rather stupid is it not? Surely more than 6 bikes could be fitted in an HST without sacrificing luggage space?  Willing to be shot down hear but there always seems to be plenty of space?

2, Better bike racks at stations is great and a sensble solution to carrying them on trains.  If however, you charge people to use a rack at a station but carry bikes free on trains you set up a perverse incentive do you not.  Charge ^5 or ^10 per jounrney for a bike.  Sure, it wouldn't cover the cost of carrying the bike, but it would at least incentivise people to leave bikes at stations and thereby lessen the number of folks wanting to travel with bikes.  You need a charge at a level which would deter commuters from taking their bikes by train in the peak every day (my making it cheaper for them to buy another bike to leave at the destination station) but not so high as to discourage the occasional traveller from taking their bike and thereby forcing another car onto the road.   

3, Bikes cause delays yes, but so do wheelchairs, luggage, pushchairs and passengers in general.  Manage them better (ie, tell people where to stand) and delays will fall. 

4, security needs to be improved, but if TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) can do it for carparks they can do it for bike racks. 

5, being bike-friendly has benefits not captured by the farebox (healthier people, less congestion etc).  It is rather unrealistic to expect TOCs to be too bike friendly unless it is written into their franchise. 

[IndustryInsider]

3, Bikes cause delays yes, but so do wheelchairs, luggage, pushchairs and passengers in general.  Manage them better (ie, tell people where to stand) and delays will fall. 

Very true. For a great example watch Oxford station on summer Sunday late afternoon and early evening services to London. They're all HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s, only one an hour mind, and if no announcements are made by the station staff then the 200 or so people wanting to board (I kid you not, there are that many!), all wait under the canopy before all realise and then they all try to board via the first couple of standard class carriage doors. Because that's a narrow part of the platform anyone with bikes then can't get past for minutes to get to the rear of the train.

If announcements are made, a few foreigners don't understand, but the vast majority spread themselves evenly along the north end of the platform and things are much better organised.

I reckon at least 3 minutes boarding time can be saved when announcements are made. Sadly, they often aren't!

[jane s]

Hi,

Just wondering why FGW^▸ (First Great Western) bother to have a "no bicycles" policy since they never bother to enforce it.

Many times I see people loading their bikes on a supposedly bike-free turbo at Reading in full view of platform staff who never say a word.

As far as I understand it bikes are not meant to be allowed on morning peak-time London-bound turbos for ANY stage of the journey, not just the arrival into Paddington. Would be nice to see it enforced (I'm fed up with trying to squeeze past them & bashing my leg on them.)

[SDS]

Personally I think we should just ban bikes 24/7. Far too much hassle and most bike passengers are rude and aggressive when you tell them there's no room for their bike, and to get on the next train.

"But cant you turn a blind eye this time"
"Like I said yesterday sir, NO"
"But there's plenty of room"
"No there's 6 bikes and thats all is allowed"
"Your an [insert verbal abuse as applicable]"
"Okay sir, thank you"

[IndustryInsider]

In peak hours they can be a nuisance.  Trouble is that with the Driver Only Operated trains that run between Reading and Paddington it's practically impossible to enforce the rules.  As you say, passengers joining a Turbo at Reading could be prevented from doing so by the station staff, but it rarely happens - the trouble is from Reading to say Twyford or Maidenhead a lot of the trains do have plenty of capacity even the barred trains.  It's beyond Slough where it can really get silly, but most of those stations are unstaffed or only have a skeleton staff, so it'd have be down to the driver.

I think the 'rules' are there to dissuade the majority of potential cycle users from joining the trains with a non-folding bike, as it would be pretty chaotic if all those who boarded with folding bikes suddenly turned up with normal ones, and it's a very difficult ruling to get just right unless you do ban them completely.  Perhaps FGW^▸ (First Great Western) should purge Reading/Maidenhead/Slough and Paddington stations for a week or so and enforce the rule properly?