Which trains can I use Groupsave 4 on?

[whole diary]

[grahame]

I'm researching a possible local flyer for the TransWilts Rail Partnership.

Warminster / Westbury / Trowbridge / Melksham to Swindon on a Saturday.

Looking up the fare for ONE adult:



For FOUR adults, specifying Groupsave 4:




I don't understand why I'm not offered a Groupsave 4 fare on the 09:49 arrival into Swindon if arriving from Warminster (but I am offered it from Westbury), nor why a Groupsave 4 is not available on the service that gets to Swindon at 11:09

Can someone (one of the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) fare experts, perhaps) explain the rules and setup of this, as I'm hoping to draft up a publicity thing that pushed Saturday trips up to Swindon for small groups, and I need to get my facts right.

[Brucey]

This is FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s list of barred dates: http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Documents/Custom/GroupSave/group%20save%20barred%20dates%202010%2019%2005%20.pdf
And their explanation: http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=43

This shows that on the 5th June, GroupSave isn't valid on any services to Cardiff Central, which would explain the Westbury to Swindon example.

However, the document does state "Please note that Group Save tickets are not valid for travel either: TO the destination stations shown below, or for journeys involving a change of train at these stations."

Depends how you interpret this as to whether these tickets would be valid on those services.  It would appear The Train Line have interpreted these very strictly and not permitted them to be sold.

[eightf48544]

Looking at the restrictions list I wonder why they bother to go to all that trouble.

It must be either be a revenue raising stunt or a subtle train rationing scheme.

I favour the former, however, I can't think how many people might have travelled to these events on a Group Save and the very little extra revenue that might be raised by banning them. It's probably cost more to work out the  restriction list, then have to go to all the trouble of having to issue the list, instruct "all staff" about them. Inform the "public". Do TM^‡(resolve)'s booking staff etc.  get a daily sheet telling what tickets are valid that day/

If there aren't many people who might have used Group Save to these events then it's not a very good train rationing system either.

I don't see the point!

[moonrakerz]

My wife and a group of her work mates went from Warminster & Westbury to Bath a couple of weeks back. I researched GroupSave for them and found the website very confusing.
In the end one of them went to Westbury station, got the tickets there after being told that they could use their tickets from the 1601 ex Warminster (the one they asked for) onwards and return on any train - which didn't seem to tally with what the Website was saying. The tickets appeared to be normal OPDRs.

[grahame]

However, the document does state "Please note that Group Save tickets are not valid for travel either: TO the destination stations shown below, or for journeys involving a change of train at these stations."

Depends how you interpret this as to whether these tickets would be valid on those services.  It would appear The Train Line have interpreted these very strictly and not permitted them to be sold.

I would suggest that ... if that is the reason ... it is so strictly interpretted as to be mis-interpretted.   Since when was a journey from Warminster to Westbury, followed by a journey onward to Swindon, travel TO Cardiff!

Thanks for the link / reasoning.   It does provide a suitably mad explanation.

[Btline]

Don't buy Groupsave online, buy at a ticket office (if you have one), because the only websites that sell them are TrainLine style ones, and they put extra restrictions on. Ticket offices just halve the price of Off Peak tickets (what is meant to happen), the TrainLine sites often suddenly decide all trains into London before 11.30 are peak!

[eightf48544]

Also Group Save are not available from ticket machines put in four people in a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) and you get 4*Fare.

Seems a bit of a swiz to me.

[grahame]

Also Group Save are not available from ticket machines put in four people in a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) and you get 4*Fare.

Seems a bit of a swiz to me.

And even on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) online booking site, you now have to select a "Groupsave 4 railcard", quantity one. If you didn't know this "trick", their web site would charge twice what you need to pay for your group.

[Brucey]

Also Group Save are not available from ticket machines put in four people in a TVM^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine) and you get 4*Fare.

Seems a bit of a swiz to me.

And even on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) online booking site, you now have to select a "Groupsave 4 railcard", quantity one. If you didn't know this "trick", their web site would charge twice what you need to pay for your group.

It used to automatically choose the correct railcard when 3 or 4 passengers were selected.  Seems this has now been disabled ... perhaps too much revenue was lost?

[Chris from Nailsea]

Hmm.

As Groupsave is a perfectly legitimate discounted ticket, I agree with eightf48544 that it's a bit of a swiz if TVMs^▸ (Ticket Vending Machine), and now apparently the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) online booking site, don't acknowledge that fact, and default to it accordingly, when applicable.

That's the sort of sharp practice that attracts so much adverse publicity - as we've seen on other topics on this forum! 

Chris. 

[Nemesis]

From a 'seller's' point of view...

Group Saves are of course valid on most off peak services, but there are times when the facility is withdrawn, for example, major music festivals or important football/rugby matches.

Personally, I find that this discount is a very good PR^▸ (Public Relations) tool for the general public and can also defuse potential conflict situations, as in groups of revellers travelling by train to a night out or soccer fans.  Properly handled, potentially awkward situations can be turned around, simply by offering a good reduction.

I have to agree that the website is not well laid out with regard to Group Saves and FWIW^▸ (for what it's worth), I will mention to those in ivory towers at next opportunity.