Oxford commuters put on 'trial' with crazy idea to save delays...

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

Apologies for the deliberately naff headline! 

From Monday there will be a 3-month trial meaning that all terminating Turbo services at Oxford on Platform 2 will go all the way down to the very far end of the platform before letting passengers off.  Doesn't matter if it's a 2-car Turbo or an 2+8 HST^▸ (High Speed Train), they will all stop at the VT^▸ (Virgin Trains - former franchises) 8/10 stop board (a remnent for when Virgin operated XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) services) located about a coach length from the northern extent of the platform.

The reason being that anything immediately behind formed of 6 coaches or less can then be allowed in the platform behind permissevely as it is thought this will save delay minutes when Turbos are sat in platform two waiting to be confirmed as empty before heading off into the sidings.

So, that means an unnecessary walk of up to 140 metres, just to get to the footbridge, along a totally uncovered section of the platform on around 3 arrivals per hour.  A pretty unapetising prospect at the best of times, but imagine if it's pouring down with rain or you have mobilility problems or heavy luggage and small children etc.?

Bearing in mind the vast majority of terminating arrivals don't have any other trains close behind anyway, this, in my opinion, is the worst example of a desperate attempt to save delays.  Inconvieniencing passengers and staff alike for very dubious benefit.

An alternative, and sensible, approach would be for the Signaller to send a quick radio call to the driver requesting he pulled up to the far end on the odd occasion it might prove useful, but, no, we have this all-or-nothing initiative instead, which I haven't heard a single person on the ground think is a good idea.  I despair sometimes!

[ChrisB]

XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) services generally follow the terminsting turbos, which are generally a few (at least!) minutes late, and the XC almost always waiting at the Home signal for the down platform.

So I suspect XC pressure on FGW^▸ (First Great Western) bia transfer of delay minutes

[IndustryInsider]

According to rumour it was a request from XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise))'s MD to Mark Hopwood.  Sounds like a classic case of somebody having to do something to please the boss!

BTW^▸ (by the way), in actual fact the XC service don't follow the terminating Turbos closely at all.  XC services depart at xx:07 and xx:36 with terminating fast services (sometimes HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s, sometimes Turbos) due in at xx:48 and xx:18 (with the odd minute or two difference here or there).  So that's over 15 minutes of a gap.  Terminating slow services are due in at xx:14 and xx:41 just behind the XC services having waited around 5 minutes at Didcot to allow them to overtake.

That's why it's such a mad idea, as it will very rarely help with delays at all - unless the XC service is running late and is immediately behind the terminating stopping service, in which case a quick call from the Signaller as I suggested would be enough.

[ChrisB]

I'm often waiting for an XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) and a terminator comes in. Guess they're often late then, and not held at Didcot for some reason to let XC past there on the avoiding line.

[Steve Bray]

Oh dear oh dear. Either this is a very late April Fool Insider, or you've had a long session on the ale What a daft idea. At least there are plenty of bikes in Oxford, so perhaps a cycle rack can be left at the far end of platform 2 for passengers to cycle down to the footbridge. And the station staff will no doubt take some flak from fed-up passengers venting their comments.

[ChrisB]

Hey! At least it will redistribute pax from the front car to the rear car!

[IndustryInsider]

And the station staff will no doubt take some flak from fed-up passengers venting their comments.

With any luck they'll vent their frustrations towards Customer Services and get the whole silly idea stopped well before the 3-month trial is up!

[Btline]

What would the SHRUG have to say if this happened at Southampton?

Passengers DUMPED at end of platform for OPERATIONAL CONVENIENCE

[IndustryInsider]

 

[Oxman]

Whatever next?!

This was suggested four years ago when the local stoppers preceded the XCs^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) from Didcot, and the XCs were often held outside Oxford waiting for platform 2 to become free. NR^» (Network Rail - home page) even produced new stop boards (which were never used, thank goodness), but the one good thing that came out of that episode was that permissive working was restored. The signalling allowed permissive working, but it had been banned following an accident on the up platform some years ago - it seems that drivers could not be trusted not to run into a train in front!

With the timetable change (which saw the XCs precede the stoppers from Didcot), there was no advantage to be gained by having the stoppers pull up to the far end of platform 2.

So why do it now?

It was resisted four years ago because:

- passengers alighting at Oxford would have to walk along an exposed platform to get back to the footbridge.

- customers boarding  services going forward from platform 2 (some Banbury stoppers and turbos (and Adelantes)) to the Cotswolds would stop at the far end of platform 2 and customers would have to walk and wait at the far end of the platform, whatever the weather, with no shelter.

- it was entirely possible that there would be additional delays, as customers ran down the platform to catch the train. God help the dispatcher that sent off a Cotswold service as Charlbury man was making his way down the platform!

- The norm is to have only one dispatcher on the platform. This proposal meant that he or she would spend most of their time at the far end of the platform, and therefore unable to deliver service to customers arriving on the platform from the footbridge.  This would also create delays.

- Last time this was proposed, XC were not prepared to have their customers inconvenienced by having their trains stop at the far end of the platform. It will be interesting to see if they also participate this time around. If they do, I predict chaos. If they don't, then questions will be asked.

Utter madness!

[inspector_blakey]

Funny how XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) never made any arrangements to accommodate FGW^▸ (First Great Western) a few years back when the xx16 southbound XC service routinely delayed the xx21 stopper and more often than not resulted in the Didcot connection for the west being missed!

[willc]

It really must be April. They're going to take a train-load of passengers and dump them at the unroofed north end of the platform in driving rain? I think not.

Bearing in mind the vast majority of terminating arrivals don't have any other trains close behind anyway

XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) services generally follow the terminsting turbos, which are generally a few (at least!) minutes late, and the XC almost always waiting at the Home signal for the down platform

.

Cotswold Line services follow very closely behind - all the more so when terminating slow trains amble in three or four minutes behind time, followed by the pantomime I describe below in terms of despatching empty Turbos.

Sorry Chris, but as someone who day after day sees what goes on, a terminating slow service arriving ahead of a delayed XC service is a rare occurrence - perhaps they arrange it just for you - and if this does happen, the Oxford signallers often use the bi-directional signalling to put the terminating service into platform 1 to get it out of the way, unless that will mess up a southbound XC.

The trains that get delayed, day after day, are the Cotswold Line services, which are booked to follow the stoppers from Didcot. The Cotswold trains are what get stuck outside the station while the ludicrously slow process of despatching an empty Turbo goes on. The 18.17 and 18.54 departures from Oxford (and the 19.23 due to a silly bunching of trains just ahead of it) often fall victim to delays in this way - on Friday the 18.17 lost five minutes at Oxford because the 18.13 arrival from Paddington (I assume the working timetable actually allows more of a margin than the public timetable's four-minute gap), running just ahead of it, was late.

For many years, the dispatchers used to stand at the south end of platform 2 then walk through a Turbo to the front, checking it was empty. Recently, they have instead started boarding next to the footbridge steps, walking though to the back of the trains, then walking up the platform, locking the doors with the buttons on the coach ends, before reaching the front of the train and finally telling the driver he can go into the sidings. And the signallers don't always assist matters here, with the shunting signal for the move to the sidings sometimes not being cleared until after the dispatchers have completed their time-consuming routine.

If they really want to get empty trains out of the platform fast, these are the places they should be looking at to make changes, not silly notions that do nothing to assist Cotswold Line HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) that will still be stuck at the signal south of Botley Road, because they are too long to fit on the platform behind a Turbo.

Of course, this was not much of an issue, at least for Cotswold trains, until a couple of years ago when the timetable was rejigged to put the stoppers out of Didcot ahead of the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) fasts. Who came up with that clever wheeze?

As for assisting XC, they have got a cheek, considering how often their trains arrive late, messing up FGW services, or the XC trains that have a timing allowance, eating up platform time at Oxford, even though their journey only started at Reading.

[paul7575]

What would the SHRUG have to say if this happened at Southampton?

Passengers DUMPED at end of platform for OPERATIONAL CONVENIENCE

Oddly enough it happens regularly at Southampton anyway.  Alternate Poole stoppers arrive and layover for 20 mins in 3B, on the same hours XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) terminate in platform 2B, so that a SN service can come in straight behind on 2A.  FGW^▸ (First Great Western) trains terminating at Southampton routinely arrive in 3B 'on top' of the train in 3A, and some off-pattern stoppers from Brockenhurst or Poole terminate at the country end of 2B.  Also on Sundays the Portsmouth - Southampton stopper operates from 3B.

So that would definitely be POOLE passengers DUMPED at far end of platform 3 and XC passengers DUMPED at far end of platform 2, use of platform 2A AXED for OPERATIONAL CONVENIENCE.

Paul

[IndustryInsider]

It really must be April. They're going to take a train-load of passengers and dump them at the unroofed north end of the platform in driving rain? I think not.

Sadly it's August.  And a wet one so far too, although fortunately (or perhaps sadly to force a premature end to the trial), there's no rain forecast for the beginning of the week.

If they don't draw down to the end of the platform then drivers will be disobeying instructions - even if it's the last arrival in Platform 2 of the night, the 2-car set which arrives at 00:22, long after any of XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise))'s services have been in the area.

As you say Will, it's the evening Cotswold HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s that suffer the most from waiting at the 'Graveyard Halt' signal during a typical day.  And this initiative won't make one hoot of a difference to them!

For many years, the dispatchers used to stand at the south end of platform 2 then walk through a Turbo to the front, checking it was empty. Recently, they have instead started boarding next to the footbridge steps, walking though to the back of the trains, then walking up the platform, locking the doors with the buttons on the coach ends, before reaching the front of the train and finally telling the driver he can go into the sidings. And the signallers don't always assist matters here, with the shunting signal for the move to the sidings sometimes not being cleared until after the dispatchers have completed their time-consuming routine.

Indeed.  Apparently "Something had to be done" to stop the very rare occasions when somebody crept on the train without the driver or dispatcher spotting them.  The convuluted method you describe was dreamt up by somebody who's long left Oxford, but we seem stuck with it.

- Last time this was proposed, XC were not prepared to have their customers inconvenienced by having their trains stop at the far end of the platform. It will be interesting to see if they also participate this time around. If they do, I predict chaos. If they don't, then questions will be asked.

It is only FGW^▸ (First Great Western) terminating services that will be affected, so nobody will have to wait to board trains out in the open.  Still utter madness though.  I'll keep an eye out and report back tomorrow with how it's going!

[Andrew1939 from West Oxon]

I agree with Will. I am not a very frequent traveller to and from Oxford and my returns are off-peak as against Will's peak use.
The number of times I have waited on platform 2 for a terminating Turbo to get away from the platform whilst I can see my CL train waiting at Cemetery Halt are beyond counting. I know they need a number of minutes to check the train through before it goes off into the sidings but far too often the train stands there with everyone waiting (for what I do not know). It has very often been the cause in the past for delayed Up trains at Oxford because the waiting terminating Turbo has delayed the Down CL train that then has delayed the UP train at Ascott. I imagine that is less likely to happen now that there is an extra 4 miles of double track between Ascott and Charlbury.