Chiltern Mainline: Nice & Fast!

[whole diary]

[IndustryInsider]

Ok, I now see what you mean. I was taking figures from the poster at stations, not the website. I'll check tonight & reconfirm....

Thanks (and thanks to Paul for guiding ChrisB into the post that I was questioning!).

Is the overcrowding situation still as critical as it was immediately after the timetable introduction?  Chiltern have made some minor changes to strengthen a few of the problem trains, and promise more in December:

From 19 September 2011 we made some changes to train formations:
 
    0654 Bicester North to Marylebone was lengthened from 5 carriages to 6
    1825 Marylebone to High Wycombe was lengthened from 2 carriages to 3

We also made some additional changes from Monday, 3 October:
 
    0717 Banbury to Marylebone (0801 from Beaconsfield) was lengthened from 6 carriages to 7 carriages
    0542 Banbury to Marylebone was lengthened from 2 carriages to 3
    1822 from Marylebone will now call additionally at Beaconsfield

The next changes will be made for our December timetable and we will inform you of these changes in the last week of October.

[ChrisB]

Overcrowding still critical on roughly 6 six trains in each peak. Unfortunately for the poor commuters (but fortunately for Chiltern's business plan, it seems), extra pax are appearing West Midlands, meaning fewer seats & now overcrowding at Banbury / Bicester on one train too.

It's all very well to attract more long distance pax, but you've got to have sufficient capacity provision to carry all in comfort. Unfortunately, it isn't the new pax that is paying for it, but their captive commuters now not getting regular seats....

From my soundings, I'm not hearing (m)any major changes in Dec11 either. The two further 'silver trains' not due until May12, and that will start capacity problems at MYB^▸ (London (Marylebone)) where a 4car clubman & an other train can fit on one platform, but turn the 4car clubman into a silver train & that other train needs a different platform!

I'm not sure their stock/station infrastructure can cope once the Oxford services kick in too!

Re those punctuality figures - the posters state the following - there may be confusion between passenger charter punctuality (within 5 minutes in each peak) and the MAA^▸ (Moving Annual Average) punctuality (all trains within 5 minutes)

Pass Charter -
Period 6 - 83.7%
Annual - 92.1% (charter for compensation 92%)

MAA
Period 6 - 87.0%
Annual - 93.0%

Reliability figures on the poster were only quoted for charter, not MAA.

Period 6 - 98.6%
Annual - 99.1% (charter for compensation is 99%)

So, both pass charter marks are only 0.1% above payouts.

Period 7 finishes today - I'm told that the reliability has risen over the period, but punctuality hasn't, so 5% discount on renewals from next Saturday once published.

[IndustryInsider]

OK, so you misread the poster originally and the 'Reliability' figure on the poster was not saying 87% then?  I thought that was an incredibly low figure!

From my soundings, I'm not hearing (m)any major changes in Dec11 either. The two further 'silver trains' not due until May12, and that will start capacity problems at MYB^▸ (London (Marylebone)) where a 4car clubman & an other train can fit on one platform, but turn the 4car clubman into a silver train & that other train needs a different platform!

I too share your concerns on Marylebone being able to cope with the extra burden having more LHCS^▸ (Locomotive Hauled Coaching Stock) services will cause.

Period 7 finishes today - I'm told that the reliability has risen over the period, but punctuality hasn't, so 5% discount on renewals from next Saturday once published.

As for punctuality, I'd be surprised if it hasn't risen a fair bit since the previous periods 83.7%, but not enough to stop the MAA^▸ (Moving Annual Average) falling below the 5% discount trigger level.  I would guess the MAA will remain below that trigger level for several months, given the poor figures in the mid-80's% recorded earlier this year in Jan & Feb.

[ChrisB]

Its needed, commuters are definitely entitled to a discount fir the crap we've had since mid-August

[paul7575]

I'm not sure their stock/station infrastructure can cope once the Oxford services kick in too!

Isn't the idea that the Oxford services are diversions of existing services that terminate elsewhere, such as at Bicester or Banbury - so shouldn't increase the actual number of trains handled at Marylebone?

I agree completely with your point about the LHCS^▸ (Locomotive Hauled Coaching Stock) taking up more platform space though, and preventing 'top train working'...

Paul

[ChrisB]

Only some of them....

[albertvie]

Overcrowding still critical on roughly 6 six trains in each peak. Unfortunately for the poor commuters (but fortunately for Chiltern's business plan, it seems), extra pax are appearing West Midlands, meaning fewer seats & now overcrowding at Banbury / Bicester on one train too.

It's all very well to attract more long distance pax, but you've got to have sufficient capacity provision to carry all in comfort. Unfortunately, it isn't the new pax that is paying for it, but their captive commuters now not getting regular seats....

From my soundings, I'm not hearing (m)any major changes in Dec11 either. The two further 'silver trains' not due until May12, and that will start capacity problems at MYB^▸ (London (Marylebone)) where a 4car clubman & an other train can fit on one platform, but turn the 4car clubman into a silver train & that other train needs a different platform!

I'm not sure their stock/station infrastructure can cope once the Oxford services kick in too!

Re those punctuality figures - the posters state the following - there may be confusion between passenger charter punctuality (within 5 minutes in each peak) and the MAA^▸ (Moving Annual Average) punctuality (all trains within 5 minutes)

Pass Charter -
Period 6 - 83.7%
Annual - 92.1% (charter for compensation 92%)

MAA
Period 6 - 87.0%
Annual - 93.0%

Reliability figures on the poster were only quoted for charter, not MAA.

Period 6 - 98.6%
Annual - 99.1% (charter for compensation is 99%)

So, both pass charter marks are only 0.1% above payouts.

Period 7 finishes today - I'm told that the reliability has risen over the period, but punctuality hasn't, so 5% discount on renewals from next Saturday once published.

The full length of the platforms are rarely used currently. Silver sets can and do share platforms 1,2 and 3 and I'd expect 5 and 6 to be added to that list as they will be allowed 9 cars as soon as the paperwork allows

[IndustryInsider]

Silver sets can and do share platforms 1,2 and 3 and I'd expect 5 and 6 to be added to that list as they will be allowed 9 cars as soon as the paperwork allows

Are Marylebone's platforms 5/6 not passed out for their full length yet then?  That would certainly counter problems caused by any additional loco-hauled services.  Welcome to the forum by the way.

[albertvie]

Silver sets can and do share platforms 1,2 and 3 and I'd expect 5 and 6 to be added to that list as they will be allowed 9 cars as soon as the paperwork allows

Are Marylebone's platforms 5/6 not passed out for their full length yet then?  That would certainly counter problems caused by any additional loco-hauled services.  Welcome to the forum by the way.

Thanks for the welcome :-)

5 and 6 have had 9 cars in but it's not officially passed. They've recently been remeasured to check the track circuits and the signal sightings and the paperwork is in progress...

[paul7575]

Only some of them....

The draft timetables published with the 73rd supplementary agreement are all I've got to go by, and in them all the morning peak arrivals (at least) at Marylebone from Oxford arrive at identical times to trains from Bicester North that have been removed.

I appreciate this may have been overtaken by more recent ideas, so if you know different perhaps you could explain a bit more?

Paul

[ChrisB]

Interesting - does that include off-peak too?

They've made the Mainline TT work with that proposed in the supp agreement then....

[paul7575]

I don't think the current timetable is exactly the same as that consulted on in 2009, in particular the idea of regular Gerrards Cross all stations stoppers (expected to be run by the 172s IIRC^▸ (if I recall/remember/read correctly)) seems to have fallen by the wayside.  However the basic principle of no additional trains can be seen by comparing the Phase 1 and Phase 2 versions side by side.

Here's the link to save you another search - they include separate 24 hr timetable files by direction, day, and with and without Oxford:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browseDirectory.aspx?root=&dir=%5cTrack%20Access%5c2%20Completed%20Consultations%5c2009%5c2009.10.27%20Chiltern%20Railways%2073rd%20Supplemental%20Agreement%20-%20consultation%20closed%2023%20November%202009

Paul

[Chafford1]

Guy Gorton's excellent photos of the changing layout at Gerrards Cross shows why trains can run so much faster now:

http://www.meadwaypark.co.uk/ChilternGX/

[ChrisB]

The Inspector reported to the Secretary of State a couple of weeks ago on the TWA application by Chiltern for their proposed Oxfotd services. The SoS has 6 months to decide, I believe

[IndustryInsider]

Any clues as to the inspector's findings, or will that remain secret until a decision?